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Commercial Kitchen Question /Venting

#1
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5/29/09 at 11:12am
  • Joined: May 2009
  • Post Count: 4
I am looking into opening a pizza parlor with some friends of mine. I have experience in running a small business as well as some cooking experience. what i lack in cooking experience the other business partners making up. what my question is we are trying to cut costs at first by minimizing our build out cost. the current space we are looking at doesn't have any venting. so to keep it low we are going with an electric pizza deck oven because from what i heard you don't need to vent it. So my question is, if we add a electric range and convection oven unit do we need a vent for that too? we're trying to keep every cost as low as possible and we got quoted for venting for a gas deck pizza oven over $7k just for the vent system and thats not even including the gas range or deep fryer. any help is greatly appreciated.
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#2
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5/29/09 at 11:57am
  • Joined: July 2008
  • Location: Central PA
  • Post Count: 672
>> you don't need to vent it.

good idea, but check with your local building code & health departments.

not all laws / regulations follow common sense.

>>>fryer, pizza oven, range - where's all that heat going to go?
hmmm, do I smell toasted guests....?

a deep fryer will most likely require not only a vent but a fire suppression system.

be very careful here, you could have some very nasty surprises "at the end" which is not what you need in a start up.
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#3
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5/29/09 at 12:02pm
  • Joined: September 2008
  • Location: Porterville, CA
  • Post Count: 658
I'd check with your local Fire Marshal before purchasing to determine venting and fire suppression requirements.

Here in California, I believe the State Fire Marshal has a list of approved "no vent required" equipment, everything else MUST be vented and anything with grease or open flame MUST have fire suppression, at least that is the information I've obtained.

Chef

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#4
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5/29/09 at 12:16pm
  • Joined: May 2009
  • Post Count: 4
thanks for the info so far. good idea on calling the fire marshal, we we're going to start with an electric pizza oven and then slowly move to installing hoods and what not. I've called many HVAC guys and they said it depends on the model. but the model i found
Doyon PIZ3 Pizza Oven ( i can't post a link becuase i have to have 5 posts)
doesn't have a vent in the electric version specs. so does that mean that it doesn't need a hood?
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#5
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5/29/09 at 12:24pm
  • Joined: March 2002
  • Location: SLC UT
  • Post Count: 4,795
While I can't address the hood issue for the electric oven, you probably still need some HVAC cooling just to make the kitchen humanly tolerable with the kind of equipment you're looking at.

more than taste fine
me eat it all the time

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#6
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5/29/09 at 12:41pm
  • Joined: September 2008
  • Location: Porterville, CA
  • Post Count: 658
Remember, "HVAC guys" don't enforce the regs, Fire Marshals, Code officers, and health inspectors DO!

Not knowing where you are located, I don't know whether regs are similar, but in my area, before you do ANYTHING, you have to get the approval of the Fire Marshal, Health Inspector, and local building department PRIOR to any construction or installation.

Again, for California, for an oven to qualify as "ventless", it must NOT emit any smoke or grease and there must be no exposed heat source.

Chef

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#7
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5/29/09 at 1:58pm
  • Joined: July 2008
  • Location: Central PA
  • Post Count: 672
you've seen several suggestions that you cease and desist making assumptions based on "but he said"

the regulatory authorities in your specific state, county, city and block should be consulted.

>>so does that mean that it doesn't need a hood?

lookie see here, I got this bridge in Brooklyn... buy my oven cause it does not need a hood, according to me. your local inspector is not my bridge's problem.
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#8
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5/29/09 at 2:51pm
  • Joined: September 2008
  • Location: Porterville, CA
  • Post Count: 658
Oops, forgot to add, the above sentence needes: "as certified by the State Fire Marshal"!

If the equipment is NOT on the State Fire Marshal's "exempt list", IT MUST HAVE A HOOD AND FIRE SUPPRESSION, regardless of what anyone else states!

Chef

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#9
Rating: 0
5/29/09 at 4:07pm
  • Joined: May 2009
  • Post Count: 4
a little update, I called the building inspector (fire marshal is sick) and he said its based on what the UL listed it as. As long as i have the number in my floor plans when its submitted they will be able to check to see if everything is okay. I am located in Cleveland Heights. I went to a local restaurant equipment dealer and they told me I don't need a hood for a pizza oven even its gas, because there is a exhaust on the oven itself that I can just tie into a duct and have it shoot horizontally out of the back of the location. As i said before this is all preliminary, i came here to get input from professionals and to get pointed in the right directions. Pete and Dillbert, I am not going to make decisions solely based on your info or anyone elses. I know I it really comes down to the building inspector, like I said just looking for other input. Almost like consulting more than one doctor.
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#10
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5/29/09 at 9:29pm
  • Joined: April 2009
  • Post Count: 36
Getting opinions ahead of time is good, but unfortunately, these things vary a lot based on where you are. I would not trust the restaurant equipment dealer unless you have some references on their expertise. Some of them know a lot about all this stuff, others just want to sell you something and tell you what you want to hear. "Listen buddy, of course you can afford the bigger model, you don't need a hood for any of these!" When the inspector tells you that you need a hood, you think the restaurant supply guy is going to pay for it? You want to be pointed in the right direction, and I applaud you for doing so, but the right direction is explore your options with the inspectors first and then choose your equipment, not the other way around.

In the spirit of looking ahead though, once you've come up with a few viable options and prices, post them here. Many of the fine folks here will be able to evaluate the pros and cons of specific scenarios much more accurately than such a board locally changing topic.

Best of Luck!
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#11
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5/30/09 at 11:02am
  • Joined: May 2009
  • Post Count: 4
Thanks for the advice, we're going to look at them on monday and have the engineer coming down today to see what he says. We have to submit plans to the city with the model number so that they can approve it or not. So we can't even buy it until it gets approved. I'll post the models we find on monday.
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