white-white wedding cake

I know this has probably been discussed here before but...

What is your favorite recipe for icing on a wedding cake that must be white-white?

I have a few but wonder if there isn't something better.

thanx in advance,
eeyore

Bright white icing has to have shortening in it, all butter is always ivory once it sits. I'd go 50/50, butter/shortening many places go 100% shortening (100% shortening is what most people complain about with bakery frostings).

Other way to get a bright white, use rolling fondant over your butter cream. Wilton sells a white food color to whiten frosting. If your making more of a simple frosting using clear vanilla extract instead of reg. which can darken your white.

Thanks, those are the basic ideas I had. I have found that even a 50/50 ratio will turn off-white. But I just cant stand the thought of Crisco icing.

I have used the stuff called "white-white" It takes so much to really make a difference, Im wondering if I do an entire wedding cake with the stuff it will effect the taste. Is that possible?

Isn't there some margarines that aren't yellow? Would they at least be better than straight shortening?

ugh
eeyore

I'll probably be burned alive for this, but oh well-

Use lard (non-hydrogenized), not shortening. It's the same consistency, is pure white, and isn't trans-fatty junk. I also think (and it may just be my imagination!) that it tastes better, in icing, or anything that calls for shortening. I haven't bought shortening for ages now.

I used a white chocolate/cream cheese icing on a wedding cake in July last year - It held up really well in the hot weather once it was chilled.

hmmmmm....interesting. Recipes?

I've always used the Wilton Buttercream Icing recipe, and just substituted lard for the shortening. The lard should be soft, room temperature. It's shelf-stable, so refrigeration isn't necessary as long as you wrap it up each time you're done with it. If you buy lard in buckets, of course, just put the lid back on each time you're done with it.

Used to use Fleischman's corn oil margarine in a buttercream at a place. Wasn't totally white, but it's a lot less yellow than butter. I think a teeny bit of blue will make the white whiter. We used to warm 18 eggs with 4 cups of sugar and then beat it till fluffy, then beat in 11 lbs margarine. The advantage of a buttercream made this way, or with an Italian meringue, is that you don't get that gritty confectioner's sugar feeling on the roof of the mouth. I would not under any circumstances use lard on a cake unless you wanted it to taste a little meaty. Disgusting..sorry.

Meaty, indeed. Plus, forget eating any if you're a vegetarian.

TBH, do you mean eggs or egg whites?

I've never noticed any kind of "meaty" taste when using lard- but it could just be me! :o

Re recipe -

Hey, Eyeore - I used the recipe from Rose Levy Berenbaum's "Cake Bible" book - got it from teh library, but don't have the whole recipe. Sorry. I do remember that there was a tip from Shirley Corriger, who said she used much less butter for a wedding cake in the hot Atlanta summer, and it worked fine. Sorry I couldn't get the whole recipe for you.

Whole eggs is what we used. Warm them up real good and them beat till thick. Course, this was 20 years ago before there was a lot of concern about eggs not being cooked to 145 or whatever. But it does make a nice buttercream.

Here I go again...

Ok, just to make sure I was not nuts-

I just went and did a little taste test. Tiny bit of lard. Tiny bit of shortening. Tasted each separately. They taste exactly the same to me. No meaty flavor in the lard. Nor the shortening (which was created to be a substitute for lard, I believe- so they made the taste mimic lard as closely as possible!) Just in case you want to try it.

However, good point about the vegetarians not wanting to eat it! Didn't think of that. :eek:

Re: Here I go again...

Vegetarian or not, it doesn't sound very appetising...

Lard is deodorized in the manufacturing process, but I still think it has a funny taste. Every year I want to make a plum pudding, but the bit about the suet increases my pucker factor too much. I broked down and made a pie crust with it this year, but I really can't handle the idea of the stuff.

I agree; it's really gross to handle.

French butter cream is always the best tasting, but it's limiting. Unforunately shortening is used and has to be used for the color and handling and temp. .

When I make my frosting I always do 50/50 butter and shortening. THEN I take that frosting and cut it 50/50 with either white chocolate butter cream or french butter cream to cut the xxxsugar taste and add flavor. I think what people object to, it's not the fat....both butter and shortening coat your palate. For me it's the xxxsugar that freaks my tongue and nose out. I hate walking into a bakery that's a cloud of xxxdust.

I prefer to use nutex as my shortening.

Frostings have fat in them, "only butter" is an mental attitute, in my opinion. All butter can be just as gross as all shortening. Cold french buttercream is horrible, warm french butter cream can be like eating a stick of butter. Both decorating frosting and classic butter cream have their advantages and disvantages. That's why I like to mix these two types of frostings as my all around frosting...cuts them both.

I have to disagree with you here, W...

Butter doesn't coat the palate the same way shortening does. It dissolves in the mouth much faster (lower melting point). It also has an irresistible flavor that simply doesn't exist in shortening. XXX sugar and shortening together is disgusting, but it's the shortening that really grosses me out. In the summer I use 20% shortening in buttercreams, but in the winter, it's 100% butter. I find an Italian buttercream to be the king.

I really don't think it's just attitude at work when people prefer butter.

thebighat,
do you have that recipe for buttercream with whole eggs?
BTW French Buttercream, we bring the whites and sugar to blood temp. If you go over, your melt point will be much lower in the finished product.

Have to put in my vote with Memoreg on the butter vs. shortening issue. Shortening just sits there on your tongue. I am an IMBC fan for decorating cakes. I think the versions with the powdered sugar are gritty and way to sweet. I did find a recipe though for a marshmallow buttercream that was a good compromise for people who liked something sweeter (marshmallow cream, butter, and pwd sugar).

I have to say I have such an aversion to the shortening that I could never be adventurous to try the lard.

o.k. feeling rather slow here....straight Italian butter cream.... and you guys can handle it the same as decorators frosting with xxxsugar & shortening? I can't, I'm starting to wonder if I'm missing something big here, like a decent recipe. I can't re-work classic butter creams the same, it smooths differently and pipes differently then decorators frosting.

S.O.S.! Can either of you post your recipe? I'm wondering what's wrong with me?

Cook to 240F:
6# sugar
1 qt. water
1 pt. corn syrup

Pour syrup into:
1.5 qt. whites, whipped stiff(add about 8 oz. sugar toward end of whip)

Add:
10 lb. softened butter (or 8# butter with 2# shortening mixed in).
Vanilla extract

Finish with paddle to remove air bubbles if you need it the same day.

I find that letting it sit out for a day settles out a lot of the air. Or you can freeze it, and the tahwing has the same effect.

2 1/2 cups sugar
and 3/4 c. water

Boil until 248*-250*. While it is boiling:

Whip 1 1/2 c. large eggwhites (about 12) with
1 1/2t. cream of tartar till soft peaks.

Add syrup. Whip on high for 2 minutes, turn to low and let beat til room temp. Add 5 cups of butter in small amounts until incorporated. If it starts to look curdled just keep beating- it will eventually turn out wonderful. You can add an optional 1 c. of Liqueur or 1 T. vanilla extract.

For smoothest consistency, use a paddle on low while you are busy doing something else for about 10 minutes.

OK, me again.

Re: shortening. I definately can tell by taste when a "buttercream" is all shortening. There is quite a difference. However I haven't compared shorten. to lard.

Re: sweetness. I am in the deep south. We like our desserts and our tea SWEET. I have heard people complain about desserts being too sweet...but RARELY.

Re: Italian butter cream. This was formerly my icing of choice...but it just isn't as reliable and stable. And still, back to the original ques.: NOT white.

Re: French buttercream. Even less white. And I like it cool--room temp. There is a french bakery nearby (only the owner speaks English--barely) that does meringue layered with hazelnut buttercream and cut in squares..YUM and sweet.

My buttercream recipe:

4# fat (3# butter--1#shorten. preferable)
6# 10X
12oz. COLD water
2t extract
8oz nonfat dry milk powder
1/4 - 1/2t salt.

It is always a hit. The last wedding I did I had two people say that they usually don't like wedding cake but they loved this one. (They probably usually get the Winn Dixie variety--shortening only)

I am now leaning toward using 1/2 margerine (Light in color) 1/2 short. And adding "White/White" And pray that the bride thinks that it is white enough. (Maybe I should put it on a ecru table cloth.LOL

eeyore

Have you tried looking for a brand of butter that's less yellow? I believe sometimes the color is actually from dye, but I seem to remember reading that more often it's the time of the year and the cow's diet that affects the color. I've seen butter anywhere from the palest, palest yellow to almost a dayglow yellow!

(I realize I know way more about chiles than I do about frosting wedding cakes - I just thought I'd throw this out into the mix!);)

I use Land O Lakes butter (sweet cream, salted) and it is a pretty pale yellow. Much less yellow than any brand of margarine I've ever seen.

Roon, you use salted butter in buttercream??

Whoops! Little brain cramp there. I don't use salted butter in buttercream icing! :o I was just thinking of general applications (toast, etc.) :) I prefer it to unsalted butter, but when the occasion calls for it, I do buy unsalted.

Sorry about that!

Thanks for the posts, I'll have to try them and compare.

Doesn't matter which brand of butter, once it sits at room temp. for 3 hours it's off white.

Eeyore, honestly before you try margarine (which adds 0 to your flavor) combine the two recipes and see what I mean. 1/2 decorators frosting and 1/2 real butter cream or white chocolate butter cream. Just 25% shortening makes it real stable and white.

I finally made white chocolate cream cheese frosting, boy...I'm not sure about it. Alone I'd rather eat straight cream cheese frosting but when it's on cake it's far better tasting then traditional cream cheese frosting. Weird results....I used my reg. cream cheese frosting and then just folded in melted chocolate for my white. Adding the white chocolate really cut the xxxsugar sweetness, it's actually less rich/sickening sweet.

I've been working on my white cake again....I played with a doctored cake mix, mixed 50/50 with butter cake. I find I have to have part mix, wether it's instant pudding, dream whip or a cake mix in with my scratch cake to get the right texture.


Also working out of the Bakers Dozen cookbook with mixed results. Although all of theirs work and are good, their not the best I've come across.

Question: I understand the concept of a white colored cake for a wedding. BUT who ever called it white cake? I can't find any old recipes that ever called any cake 'white'. It seems like it was invented when they began selling cake mixes and homemakers began making their own wedding cakes. Any thoughts?

(being such a nut that I am) I worry about having the BEST white cake possible for my tastings (cause that will close doors if I don't) but still I haven't eaten anyones 'white cake' that didn't have a mix base. Which classic scratch cake are decorators baking and calling 'white'? Butter, sponge, pound, genoise.....?

I found a several white cake recipes (non-mix based) at www.allrecipes.com. Type "white cake" in the search box and it bring the recipes right up! Most called for 1/2 cup shortening in the recipe, but some called for butter instead- you could probably experiment with substitutes.