[Brook]

Baking with Julia is also a good basic breadmaking book that offers a lot of variety. Its brioche recipe is the best I've used.

[The Ironic Chef]

I make home made bread 2 to 3 times a week and use my Kitchen Aid. It's about 10 years old and I have never had to have the gears replaced in it. I knead the dough for at least 6 minutes with the machine before turninh the dough out and finishing it by hand. I also make home made pasta with rollers that attach to the Kitchen Aid. Doughs have to be mixed in certain amounts and consistencies.
I think that if the Kitchen Aid isn't being dogged and amounts of dough do not exceed the manufacturers recommendations then the machine holds up fine for home use.

[RSteve]

See: Artisan Bread in Five Minutes a Day-link

Jeff Hertzberg is a physician, university professor, information technology consultant (www.medformatics.com), and ardent amateur baker. He developed a love of great bread growing up in New York City and refined it by travelling the bread-loving countries of Europe by bicycle. He lives in Minneapolis, Minnesota with his wife and two daughters.

Zoë François is a pastry chef and baker trained at the Culinary Institute of America. In addition to teaching baking and pastry in the Twin Cities and consulting to restaurants, Zoë creates artful desserts and custom wedding cakes. She lives in Minneapolis with her husband and two sons. Check out Zoe’s food blog at www.zoebakes.com.

Mark Luinenburg has been a commercial photographer in the Twin Cities for more than 20 years. His work has been exhibited at the Minneapolis Institute of Arts and Walker Art Center and is in the Weisman Art Museum collection. His photographs have appeared in local and national publications, including National Geographic Adventure, GQ, ESPN Magazine, Health Magazine, Minnesota Monthly, and Mpls.St.Paul Magazine.

[boar_d_laze]

In my opinion there's no such thing as "artisan bread in five minutes a day." "Artisan" bread requires technique, experience and patience. It's definitely not about time saving or convenience.

I'm not saying you can't make perfectly good bread, "no knead" style in a dutch oven -- but no matter how good, it's convenience and in now way artisanal.

My dos centavos,
BDL

[kokopuffs]

Visit this great breadbaking website. So much for 5 minutes a day bread. My poolish slowly ferments for a total time of around 15-18 hours before being incorporated into the remaining ingredients.

[KYHeirloomer]

>In my opinion there's no such thing as "artisan bread in five minutes a day."<

Thanks you, BDL, for stating what should be obvious.

This has been bugging me for a long time, but I kept quiet because I didn't want to get involved in a battle. But you're absolutely right!

[The Ironic Chef]

It takes longer than 5 minutes just for the kneading, ...Pilsbury doesn't have an Artisan Loaf, do they? Maybe 5 minute bread should go into the 5 ingredient meal category.

[kokopuffs]

Originally Posted by The Ironic Chef

It takes longer than 5 minutes just for the kneading, ...Pilsbury doesn't have an Artisan Loaf, do they? Maybe 5 minute bread should go into the 5 ingredient meal category.

Not true. Once the flour (AP flour only), water and poolish are mixed, I allow the mixture to autolyse for 40 minutes. Then salt is added followed by a 10 second knead. Autolysing allows for the gluten to develop quite well and delaying the addition of salt prevents the dough from tightening too much.

[The Ironic Chef]

Originally Posted by kokopuffs

Not true. Once the flour (AP flour only), water and poolish are mixed, I allow the mixture to autolyse for 40 minutes. Then salt is added followed by a 10 second knead. Autolysing allows for the gluten to develop quite well and delaying the addition of salt prevents the dough from tightening too much.

Well, 5 minutes have turned into 40 all of a sudden. That's after the flour, poolish and water are mixed. Not including the time it took to make the poolish. I'm wondering if there is a magic rising time too?

[kokopuffs]

Ironic:

Using an autolyse with AP flour, 5 minutes of kneading is way too long of a knead. That's what I meant. If the dough is allowed to autolyse, then very little kneading is needed.

EDIT: a dough made in 5 minutes is total bs imho. Disallowing the wait time, my loaves require 30 minutes of effort spread out over around 5-6 hours of time, including bake time.

[The Ironic Chef]

Originally Posted by kokopuffs

Ironic:

Using an autolyse with AP flour, 5 minutes of kneading is way too long of a knead. That's what I meant. If the dough is allowed to autolyse, then very little kneading is needed.

Koko, I have been baking breads for many many years. Not on a professional level. I have never heard of AP flour or the Autolyse method you have mentioned. I have tried to google this and haven't found any answers. Can you recommend a site with some information regarding what you have mentioned.

[kokopuffs]

Originally Posted by The Ironic Chef

Koko, I have been baking breads for many many years. Not on a professional level. I have never heard of AP flour or the Auyolyse method you have mentioned. I have tried to google this and haven't found any answers. Can you recommend a site with some information regarding what you have mentioned.

AP = all purpose flour. I use King Arthur AP flour.

Autolyse (check your spelling) is something mentioned by Clavel and I think is cited in one or more of the following books:

1. Bread Baker's Apprentice by Reinhart
2. Crust and Crumb by Reinhart
3. Breadbaking Across America by Gleezer

EDIT: And checkout this breadbaking site:

The Fresh Loaf | News & Information for Amateur Bakers and Artisan Bread Enthusiasts

[The Ironic Chef]

Thank you for posting the Bread Baking site Koko. I do not have that one. I found what I was looking for right away and when I get a chance I will view the video they have there explaining the process.

[kokopuffs]

Basically all you do is mix all the flour and water and allow to rest 40 minutes. During that time the enzymes break down whatever it is they breakdown and cause gluten to form.

What I do is mix the preferment (in my case the poolish) with the remaining flour, water and yeast. Allow to set 40 minutes and then knead about 10 seconds. Place the dough in a bowl and allow to double or triple in size. Then, use 1-3 French Fold sessions prior to final shaping and proofing.

French folding is described at the fresh loaf, also.

[kokopuffs]

I'm shouting: AND REMEMBER TO ADD SALT ONLY ONLY AT THE END OF THE AUTOLYSE AND JUST PRIOR TO KNEADING. TRY SPRINKLING THE SALT ALL OVER THE UNSHAPED MASS FOR EVEN DISTRIBUTION. You'll get a much MORE tender loaf that way.