Good ol' recipes

[Mezzaluna]

Hi Jodi,

It's been a while. It's good to see you again!

[shel]

Originally Posted by Mezzaluna

For example, my grandmother baked bread nearly every day of her life while her husband and children were at home. She never measured anything with a standard measure. My mom watched her bake many times, but when it came time to pass the recipe on to me, Mom had no idea how much of each ingredient was actually being used. Mom had my grandmother make three batches of bread while she measured each ingredient before my grandmother added it. (This caused quite a few flashes of annoyance, I can assure you!) Finally, the three versions were averaged, and I can now make my grandmother's challah with good results.

Do any of you have similar experience?

Would you care to share the challah recipe?

Shel

[siduri]

I don;t know how all these old recipes came out, but i can tell you that here in italy, many cookbook recipes are approximate. Some are ok, especially the ones that are cooking not baking. But the baking stuff, well, it seems to me that most people here are glad to get a little sugar, in whatever form, and that's enough for them. Cakes are dry, usually overly sweet, not very interesting. The crumb is usually riddled with wormholes (like when you beat the batter too long) and many cakes are made by pouring a pile of flour on a board, making a "well" and putting in sugar, eggs, melted butter, etc, and believe me, you don';t want to learn to make them.
So... while there are some wonderful old family recipes, i think a lot of stuff is overrated. I used to dream about the things my mother said her mother used to bake back in the "old country". But when i got a taste of them visiting the relatives here, i can tell you, most of them were not very interesting. But in those days sugar was a real luxury, and it didn;t matter much what you put it in, people liked it. So my mother remembered the treat as special, because anything sweet was special.

I do have some good ones, but many of those are good because i've doctored the recipes myself, adding butter, etc, changing the method (creaming rather than mixing all together at once) etc.

That said, i think a lot of the precision of today's recipes is annoying, especially when you're talking about cooking, not baking. Like, who measures a cup of chopped onions? It doesn;t really matter, a little more or a little less. I prefer more realistic recipes that say, for example, a couple of medium onions, chopped. Salt, in particular, is strange to measure. You add salt till it tastes good. What i do is salt with a salt shaker, imagining the food being in my dish, and how much i would want on it.

[shroomgirl]

how topical....a 93 year old friend is getting ready to move to Fla and I keep saying I wanna watch her make chicken and dumplings. She talks me through it all the while saying how easy it is to make. But there's just something about watching and touching that make the difference between something good and something great.

She makes all her own egg noodles,slaw, etc...a wealth of cooking lore.

[cookie jim]

I hope you never break that cup. I still have Grandmaws Carnival glass juicer which I handle carefully and put well out of the way when through with use. I just wanted to suggest weighing the flour from the recipies in case,God forbid,something happens to your treasure....good cookin...cookie

[bluedogz]

I learned this in an unusual way when I asked my grandpa how to make his split-pea and sausage soup as a teenager. The recipe was simply, "A couple of ham hocks, a link of polish sausage, a bunch of carrots, bunch of celery, couple bay leaves, and a gallon of water for every bag of peas. Double up if you have some guys coming over." I never thought to ask the grizzled old fireman how many people that was supposed to serve. Turned out his recipe was meant to feed a ladder company of six firemen, a chief, two drivers, and a dog! "Some guys coming over" meant he had to feed the engine company too!

I ate that pea soup for over a week. Good thing I was in college... doubling up was a bad idea, in retrospect.

[greenawalt87]

I have all my mothers recipes and yes ingredients no other info.thes do include baking too All written down on envelopes,scap pieces of paper, old store recipt, all stuck in old cook books . I have duplicated most of them and have written them down in some kind of form, but I am the same way notes but thats it.
I believe that our parents and grandparents food was so good because they touched the food with thier hands and the love inside of them would come out into the food. I believe that is the different from a good cook and another not so good cook.

[deltadoc]

My mom's recipe box, was index cards with amounts listed. But the quality of the stuff she used was usually much better 50-70 years ago. But her taste in food and mine was completely different. And dad didn't like garlic and mom couldn't use spices because of her gall bladder.

Therefore the reason that I know how to cook. It was a necessity, and because they were depression era survivors, they never threw away the old stove and it got hooked up in the basement. So thats where I learned how to cook. Luckily mom's sister Dorothy was an extremely good cook and her internation travelling husband, Italian, passed on some outstanding chef recipes that he collected.

Most of her recipes were cut off boxes, newspapers, ads, chocolate chip bags, etc.

About the only recipe I use is the one from her mother's mother for rhubarb pie using lemon juice and lemon zest. Never came across another like it and it is fabulous! Our rhubarb patch died out last year so we didn't get any rhubarb, but it is returning this year and looking healthy. oh boy!

doc

[Mezzaluna]

Would you care to share the challah recipe?

Sorry, Shel, I was out of town. My mom calls this her "versatile dough" as you can morph it into cinnamon rolls, coffee cake or use it for challah. She made some small changes in it and since she took the trouble to measure it all and write it down, I guess she deserves to have her name on it!

Rosetta's Versatile Dough
1. Proof the yeast: Into a small cup place 1 teaspoon sugar, 1 packet instant dry yeast, 1/4 cup warm water (105-115 degrees). Allow to sit until bubbly.

2. For the dough: In a large heavy bowl combine 3.5 cups flour, 1 teaspoon salt, 1/4 cup sugar. In a 2-cup measure, beat 2 eggs, then add enough warm water to equal 1 cup liquid. Add the corn oil to the water. Add the yeast mixture and add the liquid to the flour in the large bowl. Use a fork to blend until you need to use your hands.

3. Start kneading and rounding the dough with your hands. (On humid days you may need more flour.) When the ball and sides of the bowl are clean, turn out onto a well-floured board and knead at least 10 minutes.

4. When the dough is no longer sticky, oil the bowl, put the dough in it, and turn to oil the dough on all sides. Let the dough rise in a warm place (away from drafts), covered with a towel. Let rise until double and a finger indentation remains. "Punch" down the dough, turn it out onto a floured board and knead slightly.

5. Shaping a challah: Cut the dough in two, then cut each piece into three equal pieces; braid, tucking the ends underneath the loaf. Let rise double.

6. To bake: Paint the dough with egg wash (one yolk + 1 teaspoon water). Sprinkle with poppy or sesame seeds. Place on oiled baking sheet. Bake in a 350° or 375° oven until brown. Cool on a rack. (**You can shape conventional loaves and bake in an oiled bread pan.)

7. FOR MAKING SWEET DOUGH FOR CINNAMON ROLLS: Add another 1/4 cup sugar to the dough and use 1/3 cp melted butter instead of oil. Add a third egg if you wish. Roll the dough into a rectangle 1/4" thick. Brush dough with butter. Sprinkle with a mixture of white and brown sugar plus cinnamon (add raisins if desired). Roll, then cut into 2" slices. Place in buttered baking pan; crowding is fine. Brush with more butter and sprinkle with more sugar mixture if you aren't going to frost them. Let rise until doubled, then bake as above.

[shel]

Originally Posted by Mezzaluna

Sorry, Shel, I was out of town. My mom calls this her "versatile dough" as you can morph it into cinnamon rolls, coffee cake or use it for challah. She made some small changes in it and since she took the trouble to measure it all and write it down, I guess she deserves to have her name on it!

Rosetta's Versatile Dough

Thanks so much. I'm not much of a baker, but have promised myself to learn, and making challah - a good one - will be my triumph. Fortunately - at least for now - there are several bakeries in the area that put out a nice challah for the weekend, so when a challah fix is needed, it's obtainable. Who makes the best challah in the area is often a hotly debated topic, although five or so bakeries are generally acknowledged as "the best" <LOL> A couple of the bakeries even make little rolls with the challah dough, as well as smaller challahs, so an entire loaf isn't needed to satisfy the craving.

Thanks for the recipe.

Shel

[Mezzaluna]

You're welcome! Let me know how it comes out.

I first made this myself on the first Sabbath I after our wedding. I made one loaf and several mini-loaves for the freezer. It took a while to learn about proofing time; even under-proofed it tasted pretty good, but I learned to be more patient.

For the Jewish New Year my grandmother made one large, coiled loaf. The tail of the coil was pulled on top, then cut to look like a small hand. As kids we called it "God's hand on the world" and fought over who'd get it to dip in honey.

[shel]

Originally Posted by Mezzaluna

You're welcome! Let me know how it comes out.

I first made this myself on the first Sabbath I after our wedding. I made one loaf and several mini-loaves for the freezer. It took a while to learn about proofing time; even under-proofed it tasted pretty good, but I learned to be more patient.

For the Jewish New Year my grandmother made one large, coiled loaf. The tail of the coil was pulled on top, then cut to look like a small hand. As kids we called it "God's hand on the world" and fought over who'd get it to dip in honey.

I'm sure it'll be a while before I attempt making challah. Baking, for some reason, intimidates me, although I have baked a few things in the past, including sourdough loaves, whole wheat bread, and my "famous" lemon poppy seed loaf. I enjoyed making the breads, all by hand - no KitchenAid mixer - it was almost a spiritual thing, getting my hands into the dough, watching it rise, kneading it ...

I've promised myself to try baking again, and have gone so far as to get some great tasting poppy seeds and print out the recipe for the poppy seed loaf.

Maybe I ned to go eat some challah to get motivated to bake some.

Thanks again ...

Shel

[shel]

Originally Posted by Mezzaluna

I read an article today which mentioned that cooks in the "old days" might jot down a list of ingredients, mention a particular cooking vessel or pan, and only roughly note proportions. This makes it difficult for those of us who want to reproduce recipes from ancestors or mentors, because we have a tough time duplicating those old dishes.

Do you have recipes like this? They could be family recipes or dishes you have prepared professionally. Maybe you found recipes like this in heirloom or antique cookbooks.

You might enjoy reading The Classic Cuisine of the Italian Jews, by Edda Servi Machlin, Traditional Recipes and Menus and a Memoir of a Vanished Way of Life. I think you'd enjoy it.

Shel

[KYHeirloomer]

Mezz,

Any idea why instant yeast is specified when it's being proofed anyway? Wouldn't dry active work just as well?

[Mezzaluna]

My grandmother used plain ol' Fleishman's or Red Star yeast packets. Since then my mom tried the instant yeast with good results. I believe Alton Brown prefers it too, but I heard that after Mom was already using it.

To tell you the truth, I do what successful bakers tell me to do. I'm better on the other side of the kitchen.

Thanks for the book suggestion, Shel. My collection of Jewish cookbooks is growing slowly. My latest addition is The Jewish Kitchen: Recipes and Stories from Around the World by Clarissa Hyman.