[shahar]

I've been trying lately to quantify most of my recipes, temperatures and quantities. I'm looking for consistent equations that deal well with chenging conditions and products. My question is about poaching seafood.

For calamari the recipe usualy calls for bringing water to a boil throwing in the sliced calamari, cooking for about ten seconds and icing in a water batch.
Far from consistent. What temperature the water should be for best results? For how long? Is it the same for all cuts of calamari, for all sizes? Icing or not? Maybe slow chilling? Maybe chilling in the liquid? etc?

I'm not looking for guesses, I got plenty. I can experiment but if any of you already did, or if you read relevent info, please share and save me the twenty-thirty batches I would have to make. Thanks.

Same thing with lobster. My recipe is boiling water again, 3 mins for tails(4 for big ones), 6 mins for claws(7 ditto). Ice water.
Any better, scientific approaches? Much obliged.

Shrimp. Same question.

[dano1]

boiling or poaching? I'm a little confused.

Originally Posted by shahar

I'm not looking for guesses, I got plenty. I can experiment but if any of you already did, or if you read relevent info, please share and save me the twenty-thirty batches I would have to make. Thanks.

Cooking is not a mathematical equation, although some may argue otherwise. If you get it after 20-30 tries your doin good. Just like life, there are no shortcuts or substitutes for experience.

[MarkV]

Poaching is from 160 to 185 degrees, simmering is beyond 185, and boiling is when you obviously achieve a full boil. These temperature differences are not arbitrary and have significant ramifications for the food to be cooked. The hotter the fluid, the more destructive it’s force, not only from the higher temperature but the increased turbulence as well. You would never put a fragile piece of fish into boiling water. The heat and agitation would disintegrate it. Therefore, the temperature of the poaching liquid should be checked during cooking with an instant read thermometer.

[KeeperOfTheGood]

Originally Posted by shahar

I've been trying lately to quantify most of my recipes, temperatures and quantities. I'm looking for consistent equations that deal well with chenging conditions and products. My question is about poaching seafood.

Originally Posted by MarkV

Poaching is from 160 to 185 degrees, simmering is beyond 185, and boiling is when you obviously achieve a full boil. These temperature differences are not arbitrary and have significant ramifications for the food to be cooked.

There is a qualifyer that MUST first be mentioned. AT SEA LEVEL. When you live in the mountains at 10,000 feet, cooking has a whole different meaning in terms of temps and times. (also, barrometric preasure plays a roll too)

http://www.biggreenegg.com/boilingPoint.htm

and a handy chart on yhis page too.


The only way to know is to do it, and do it, and do it, till you just know. And when you go to the rockies, expect that what you know will no longer apply, and that you will need to spend some time and get the feel for it all over again.

[shahar]

Cooking is not a mathematical equation, although some may argue otherwise

But cooking incoperates alot of science and equations.

[dano1]

whats the old saying? You give 10 cooks the same recipe and you'll end up with 10 different dishes...

Just because i "know" what a Standard vinaigrette "ratio" is 3-1, does this apply to every vinaigrette in every application with every oil and acid?

In response to your question, cook until done to your liking. Any less is underdone, any more is overcooked.

[shahar]

In response to your question, cook until done to your liking. Any less is underdone, any more is overcooked.

Sorry, but that's far from help. I can tell when underdone from over cooked. Temperatures and timing count, in order to get perfect texture(s).

62c for foiegras torchon. 2 mins per 100 gram.

Salmon, 65c, 140f. Would never dry out.

220f, 100c for herb oil. Prevents botritis and preserve color.

There is a place for personal taste, preferance. Products do vary. But, there IS relevence for a scientific approach. Water acts differnetly in different temperatures. Brine works differnetly in different ratios. Etc.

If anybody knows something of relevence to my question, please share. If you want to invalidate my point of asking it, we can start a new thread.

thanks.

[KeeperOfTheGood]

Dude, your question has been answered as well as it will be without your going to university for a 4 year honours batchalors, 2 years honours masters, and 1 year doctoral degree. And the people that do are the ones that make the box lables that read "microwave on HI for 5 to 6 1/2 minutes, rotate and check for doneness halfway through, and let stand for 2 minutes, all cook times approxamite, microwave ovens vary, based on a standard microwave oven of 443 watts"

EDIT: Here is a site of recipies for foie gras, no two agree on times, or temps. http://www.theworldwidegourmet.com/m...s/foiegras.htm

Read this (the link is MUCH longer that the quote):

http://www.iseek.org/sv/13000.jsp?id=100324

Career: Food Scientists

Overview

Food scientists conduct research to develop food products that are healthy, safe, and appealing.

Food scientists work in the food processing industry. They also work for universities and the federal government. They help meet consumer demand for food products that are healthy, tasty, and convenient. To do this, they conduct research using their knowledge of chemistry and other sciences.

The work of food scientists varies depending on their specialty area. Some food scientists engage in basic research to discover new food sources and products. They analyze food content to determine levels of vitamins, fat, sugar, or protein. They search for substitutes for harmful additives such as nitrites. Food scientists also study methods to improve the quality of foods. For example, they might look for ways to improve flavor, color, texture, or nutritional content. In addition, food scientists develop methods to process, preserve, package, or store food. New methods must meet government rules and industry standards.

Food scientists who work in product development apply the findings of food science research. For example, they test new products in test kitchens. They also confer with specialists to resolve problems with products. For example, they might consult flavor experts or process engineers. In government jobs, food scientists develop food quality standards and safety and health regulations. Some food scientists enforce government regulations by inspecting food processing areas.

All food scientists keep records of their research and write reports of their findings."

[shahar]

Once again, KeeperOfTheGood, thanks for your opinion. But, I was not claiming there's one way and one way only to cook anything. I've been in this bussiness twenty years, I know.

I'm looking for recipes for seafood poaching/blanching/boiling that have a more precise measure to them. You CAN give measures. Look at every recipe, it will gave amounts of salt, flour etc. Why not include temps and timings?!

Again, we can discuss the merits, pros and cons of using temperatures, so let's start a new thread for that.

In the meanwhile, does anybody has a good recipe for cooking calamari, shrimp and lobster in liquid. A recipe that include temps and timing. Please share. Thanks.

[dano1]

latest rage, butter poaching. Buerre monte ~180f. Immerse your ___size shrimp or ___size lobster for____minutes.

You fill in the size("big ones" for lobster tail doesn't count), i'll fill in the time.

Do i get a cut of the cookbook?

[kuan]

Some people have different styles of cooking, learning, walking, eating, reading the paper. Maybe this method works for Shahar. It might not work for you guys but maybe he's had a lot of success with it.

Remember the old guidelines for fish? 10 minutes per inch?

[shahar]

There's nothing newbieish about that question. But I've seen your approach with some of my cooks. Thinking they're above timers, thermostats and scales. Then they're surprised why their herb oil loses color after a few days, why their bread is sometimes crusty and sometimes spongy, why their yogurt is sometimes thick and sometimes watery.

Food IS NOT a science, but science is a useful tool for cooking. Understanding how glutten works help set in your mind the importence of long kneading, and the perils of overkneading. Understanding how and why botritis forms can help you avoid killing your customers.

Any food item can be cooked in numerous ways. But only if you qauntify and set each one of them, will you get consistency, as opposed to a ye olde yo-yo shoppe.

You can cook for years, thinking you're an artist, letting your finely tuned timing, and finger thermostats guide your way, or you can use proffesional equipment.

[dano1]

guess i hit a nerve....Good luck chef.

[kuan]

Originally Posted by shahar

There's nothing newbieish about that question. But I've seen your approach with some of my cooks. Thinking they're above timers, thermostats and scales. Then they're surprised why their herb oil loses color after a few days, why their bread is sometimes crusty and sometimes spongy, why their yogurt is sometimes thick and sometimes watery.

Food IS NOT a science, but science is a useful tool for cooking. Understanding how glutten works help set in your mind the importence of long kneading, and the perils of overkneading. Understanding how and why botritis forms can help you avoid killing your customers.

Any food item can be cooked in numerous ways. But only if you qauntify and set each one of them, will you get consistency, as opposed to a ye olde yo-yo shoppe.

You can cook for years, thinking you're an artist, letting your finely tuned timing, and finger thermostats guide your way, or you can use proffesional equipment.

I've been cooking for years, and sometimes I burn stuff, but that's what timers are for. Other than that, I can guarantee you that everything I make on the hot line, even desserts which require leavening, can be made without a recipe. Once I developed a feel for things, I've never burnt a caramel, broken an emulsion, or boiled a creme. Feel free to disagree.

OTOH, please don't take it personally if someone disagrees with your point of view. You started the topic, perhaps some people have a different take on the subject. I've requested that others be tolerant and open themselves to the fact that your contribution is valuable. I respectfully ask that you do the same.

[Kerryclan]

I was curious about this topic and so I seached numerous sites and recipes for poaching, boiling, fish or shellfish. I haven't found one yet that references temperature of the liquid. The terms "boil", "simmer" and the time of cooking are used to indicate doneness. Example: bring stock to a boil, add shrimp, lower to simmer and cook for 2 mins. - is typical of the instructions for cooking in liquids. I quess this is because there's so much variation with the kind of liquids used, the seafood, and the boiling points of different liquids that it's become more a function of state of liquid and time.

BTW,
I thought it was a great question. Really got me thinking and researching. And that's good even if you don't always get the answer you want or expect.