Can you tell the Difference ?

[cape chef]

Live_to_cooks Question on freezing a rib roast made me think. ( I do think sometimes)
At three dollars a # there is a very good chance that the meat you purchased is graded at the SELECT level, Just under choice # 2.Yes there are two grades of choice. My question to everyone is there are distinct ways to determine the grade that the USDA has graded your meat. This can be a little complex because unfortunately you can't believe everything you read on a portioned cut of beef.Some simple things to look for without getting to techy. Is the whiter the fat is a good indication of it's grade ,the whiter the better and the shade cream to yellow appear this indicates a lower grade of beef. Also the marbling is key .You want to be able to clearly see the marbling and again the whiter the better. The problem with store bought packaged beef ,already portioned is that you will not be able to see the USDA stamp,It is trimmed out.when I am not so tired I will come back with a little more detail. I thought some might want to know a little about the meat they purchase.
cc

[momoreg]

Is the same true for other meats?

This isn't directly on the topic but I thought it might be of interest. I've spent a bit of time in Argentina and the beef down there all (at least what I saw) had yellow fat - nearly the same color as butter. When I asked about that I was told it was because the beef was not fattened on grain in feed lots but was simply allowed to graze. If true I think that would be consistent with what capechef is saying about color and quality.

[Live_to_cook]

cape chef, you might be right... how could I tell? Though the roasts appeared well marbled and the fat was quite white...

[Katherine]

Pork has a reputation for having the flavor influenced by the type of feed the producer used. I raised a pig once. We fed it corn, but in the end it didn't taste like we expected it to.

[This message has been edited by Katherine (edited 12-24-2000).]

[shroomgirl]

Feed makes a difference...grass fed beef taste really different than beef finished on grain. Likewise the pig I buy is so flavorful and wonderful that it leaves me wondering if the stuff in the store ever squeeeled.

The mystique around Smithfield hams is that the hogs are finished on peanuts. Smithfield, VA is in the middle of that state's peanut-farming area and after the peanuts are harvested the pigs are turned into the fields to root out all the peanuts that were missed in the harvest, which supposedly are quite a lot. After that, the pigs are converted to hams and processed in the country-ham manner. (Although the Smithfield company has for years been part of the ITT conglomerate. Maybe they should be considered as industrial-style country hams.)

I prefer Missouri country hams, and order my Christmas ham every fall from Esicar's Smokehouse in Cape Girardeau. They hang them in July and August, and ship them the week before Christmas. Prosciutto is nice, and Black Forest and Serrano hams are good, but there's nothing like a Missouri country ham. Hung six months, they're tougher than a Drill Sargeant's boot, but, sliced sufficiently thin, they melt in your mouth.

My father used to hang them for one or two years and, after the mold is removed with a wire brush, this makes a treat that's hardly available any more.

Nostalgically,

Mike

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travelling gourmand

[shroomgirl]

Thanks for the info Mikelm, I go through Cape often enough, I'll check out the hams.
Two years and mold huh??!!! Where did he store it? I wonder if my basement is suitable?

Dick,

All I can type is that you want grain-fed beef. Believe me, that's what you want. I've had the so-called grass-fed here in AZ and all I long for, especially in a burger, is that grain-fed stuff I grew to know and love.

The best beef here in AZ is imported. Who wants a range-fed cow when one can have a fine Iowa steak? Hello! You want a steak that was fed sage brush or one that had the green pastures of IA and a winter of grain?

Don't even get me started.

Why should one pay $25/lb. for a steak (average pricen at A.J.'s) when one can get it shipped to them for $5.99/lb.?

Angelina

[Nick.Shu]

i think many factors would influence what happens to meat. Most people who have seen cornfed chickens would confirm that in some animals, what the animal eats can even cause a colour change in the meat itself.

From what i know and have seen, animals would tend to vary due to some of the following:

Genetics
Feed type
Abbatoir handling
Age
Amount of exercise
stress levels

Feedlot beef seems to be better due to food given and the fact that the animals dont get much exercise. Obviously the more exercise a animals gets, the more tougher and leaner the musculature becomes. A good example of this is the legendary japanese "wagyu" cattle, the source for kobe beef.

These animals are so well looked after, they border on being spoilt. Some of the rumours about their rearing methods include: Daily massages and being fed a high carbohydrate diet (beer!). If you can get it do so.

Shroom...
I'm not too sure about basement storage. My house, at least, is room temperature in the basement- 67-70 deg. and I don't think this is low enough. My father (who grew up on a farm in Jackson, MO, just up the road from Cape) had a hobby farm near Frederick, MD, and built his smokehouse behind the house there. The hams hung winter and summer, without heat or, obvioulsy, cooling. Seemed to work OK; nobody died from the hams, and some of them certainly LOOKED poisionous after a couple or three years. The climate in St. Louis is not a lot different, so that might work for you. You should talk to the people at Esicar's about the details of proper storage.

As I mentioned, you put them under running water and brushed off the mold with a wire brush, and then cooked tham. The cooking rules are thay they MUST be completely submerged in the water.

If you get serious about this, you would lay down a supply of hams (in a proper storage) which Esicar had smoked, and pull them out at intervals, replenishing them as you go.

Works for fine wines. Boy, would these be fine hams!

When you get this going, let me know. I'd be happy to come down from Chicago and have some ham at your restaurant!

Angelina:
Who's shipping really good steaks for $5.99 a pound? It certainly isn't Omaha Beef!
If it's a restaurant supplier, I think I could eat enough of that steak to make them think I'm a restaurant. What the h*ll, I have lots of life insurance and my kids could use the money.

Mike
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travelling gourmand

[This message has been edited by MikeLM (edited 01-23-2001).]

Angelina - Yes, I agree with you 100%. The beef in Argentina was not even close in quality to ours. Much tougher with a very different flavor - the flavor I suppose one could get used to eventually, but the chewiness, no.

Crudeau - Also 100%. My first antelope was shot after running for some time and was virtually inedible - there was no way to "hide" the taste. Had I known at the time (some 20 years ago) I wouldn't have taken the shot.

Nick.shu:

I agree with you. Many game animals are killed after a long chase. The adrenaline created by the chase gives the meat a "gamey" taste. In addition, proper butchering is very critical when it comes to game animals.

My first antelope was killed a few minutes after the season opening and he had not run at all. It was very good. But I have heard some real horror stories.

Same with game birds. I had a sage hen once that cooked up beautifully, but was impossible to eat because it had been eating sagebrush. Even my dog wouldn't eat it and she loved "road apples".

I once cooked some mountain goat. There is absolutely no way to make it tender because of all the sinewy material throughout the meat. Tasty, but not tender.

I am sure that some of the same things apply when it comes to non-game animals.

Everyone has made good points…

Sure, feed will always effect the meat in someway. The feed is often what distinguishes higher quality products from more average products. An example of this is Bell & Evans poultry. Some examples of this are more profound than others. I certainly found the Smithfield ham comment interesting and reasonable. Ask any feed company and I am sure that you could produce eggs of just about any color based on feed. Not meat related but has anyone tasted milk from a cow that just fed on wild onions? Sure to be an epiphonic experience. Also I have always herd that the color of the fat is a determiner of age... the same holds true for poultry etc. Argentine Beef is new to the US market and is touted for its better flavor. This is partially due to the fact that Argentine beef is slaughtered at an older age than we typically slaughter here in the US. Also Of the two grades in choice the highest grade is at maximum the top 5% of choice...just as 1% of beef is prime grade. Any major meat purveyor should be able to tell you the differences.

I do not often make sense...I babble, I hope that I provoked

I just have to join in on this party! I sold poultry at the wholesale level for many years, so I saw birds of all kinds from all over the country. The determining factor of skin color for poultry is feed. On the east coast, customers want a bright yellow skin color, which is achieved by adding dandelions or marigolds to the feed. The rest of the country likes the snow white skin color, which is helped along by adding egg shells or oyster shells to the feed. BTW, this is also what is added to almost all layer hen feed to produce a harder egg shell.
Color of fat may change ever so slightly after butchering, but for most people, it is almost unnoticable until the meat is actually nasty. The feel of the skin and meat is the true test, any meat that has a slick sheen is old.
As for eggs, shell color is determined ONLY by the breed of the bird, and that is really the only difference betwenn brown and white eggs. The inside is very nearly exactly the same. Taste of eggs can be affected by feed, grass fed chickens produce a very eggy, almost gamy tasting egg. Yolk color can sometimes be affected by feed, but usually by the age and condition of the chicken.
The best way to buy any meat is to know your butcher and ask questions, or better yet, buy at a farmer's market direct from the producer or packer!