[MaryB]

The Weber is $199 on Amazon Amazon.com: Weber 2820 Smokey Mountain Cooker/Smoker: Home & Garden I have 80 pounds of butts going on the Klose tomorrow. Friends want BBQ for the freezer for this winter.

[boar_d_laze]

Originally Posted by MaryB

The Weber is $199 on Amazon Amazon.com: Weber 2820 Smokey Mountain Cooker/Smoker: Home & Garden I have 80 pounds of butts going on the Klose tomorrow. Friends want BBQ for the freezer for this winter.

The reason I gave the HD price rather than an e-tailer's discount was because the OP, Mapiva, is having her party on Monday. That is a great price, though. Add a Maverick ET-71 and you're ready to go.

BDL

PS (ON EDIT) I envy you your Klose. I'm happy it's in the hands of someone who deserves it!

[teamfat]

One thing you might want to consider is doing chuck instead of brisket. A nicely marbled 3, 4 pound beef chuck roast can be smoked to 140 - 145 F ( a medium rare ) in maybe half the time or less than a full brisket, and at that temp, after an hour or so rest, will be tasty. Taking it higher and letting the collagens break down more completely will make it more flavorful and tender.

If you keep a probe thermometer in whatever meat you are smoking, and watch it during the cook you will see the temp start to rise for a while, and then somewhere in the 160 - 180 range or so depending on various factors involved with that particular piece of meat, it will seem to stop cooking, the temp will stop going up. It may even drop a degree or two, go back up, drop a bit, and so on. This plateau is a critical stage. What is happening is that internally the tough, fibrous connective tissue is breaking down into smaller chain proteins, gelatin and such. The meat is going from tough to tasty. Patience will be rewarded.

When this process is done, after an hour or two or three the internal temp will start to rise again. For a tough, long muscle grain cut like brisket, this process is essential. For a more forgiving hunk of meat like a chuck roast which is more tender from the beginning, it isn't a necessity.

Treat the chuck like a brisket, coat with a good rub, mustard slather optional. I usually don't bother with injecting or marinades, sometimes just using salt, pepper and granulated garlic as the seasoning.


Boy, I may have just talked myself into smoking some chuck saturday. Sunny, unseasonably hot weather predicted for saturday, with a cold front and storm coming in for sunday and monday. A pan of smoked beef enchiladas hot out of the oven on a stormy night could be just the thing!

mjb.

ps: Boy, a whole day or so without theses forums, I was starting to have withdrawal issues!

[Koukouvagia]

Ok so here's where I'm at. Buying a brisket was no easy feat. I had to check at 3 different butchers. Next time I will special order it so that I can get a very prime cut. This time forgive me but I got a not so fancy brisket, 6lbs. So hubby is excited, he's been reading all your posts and wants to give this a shot. I'm sure he'll be excited to try to bring the ECB up to par like suggested.

I plan on marinading over night like BDL suggested, and had the butcher trim it for me.

Here are some specific questions I have about proceeding.

1. Does the ECB have to be "warmed up" or prepared before I stick the meat in? Should I wrap the meat in foil?

2. Will adding hickory chips be overkill on smokiness?

3. How many hours will it take for a 6lb brisket to cook? Should I cut it in half or something?

4. The above post confused me a little bit. Should I be trying to make it mediume rare??? Or should I try to smoke it to a certain internal temperature? What temp should I shoot for? How do I know it's done?

5. Why does it have to rest for sooo long?

6. I was overwhelmed with the bbq sauces on the store shelf. I don't know anything about them so what should I get if I want something not too sweet, a little tangy, with a little heat?

7. I don't want to jump the gun here, but once we're ready to eat do I slice across the grain?

8. What's a bark... and a smoke ring?

9. Can I stick my baked potatoes in there too or will they get smoky?

Thank you again for taking the time to help me!

[MaryB]

While the ECB is preheating you can take the brisket out and let it come up to room temp.

I would use hickory chunks if you can find them, don't soak them either.

I am guessing you got a flat cut, 1- 1 1/2 hours per pound at 225 to 250. Depending on your temps it may take longer or shorter. Brisket needs to go to 195 or so to get tender. I would take BDL's suggestion and foil, this will help you keep from drying out the meat.

Bark is the crusty outer part that may look like charcoal but it tastes really good. A smoke ring is the reddish color you see when you slice, it will penetrate the meat 1/2 inch or so.

Foil the potatoes until almost done then unwrap and let them get some smoke, this also crisps up the skin(my favorite part).

A long rest lets the meat juices go back into the meat so when yu cut it the slices don't dry out as fast and yes you slice across the grain.

One of the biggest rules in BBQ is it is done when it is ready and not by any set time. Humidity, wind, etc can all play a big factor in how fast you cook. Right now you should concentrate on trying to keep the ECB between 225 and 275. Don't worry if it spikes higher or lower for a bit, its just part of the cook.

[boar_d_laze]

Originally Posted by Mapiva

Here are some specific questions I have about proceeding.

1. Does the ECB have to be "warmed up" or prepared before I stick the meat in? Should I wrap the meat in foil?

Yes, the fire needs to be started and stabilized before the meat goes in. You should not wrap the meat in foil until it hits "the stall," about 155F. Then, YOU should wrap. (Most, more advanced barbecuers don't. But you should. It makes things go faster and easier.) By the time the meat is wrapped, it won't absorb any more smoke anyway.

2. Will adding hickory chips be overkill on smokiness?

Adding smoke wood to the charcoal would be a good thing. Chunks mixed with the charcoal are better than foil packs of chips -- but either works. If possible use hardwood lump charcoal rather than briquettes. The taste differences are substantial. It's a regional thing, but hickory is usually not the first choice for brisket. In the west we prefer oak or mesquite. Pecan, apple and cherry are also popular throughout the country. Hickory is more of a southern, and thus a pork thing.

3. How many hours will it take for a 6lb brisket to cook? Should I cut it in half or something?

6 pounds is getting pretty small to cut in half, but if necessary you can. Two three pounders won't taste as good as one 6 pounder, plus there will be more waste. Your 6 pounds of brisket will feed 8 without leftovers if there's a lot of other food.

Without knowing what tempurature your ECB is going to find as its natural, it's hard to tell you how long cooking will take. Figure about 2 hours per pound.

4. The above post confused me a little bit. Should I be trying to make it mediume rare??? Or should I try to smoke it to a certain internal temperature? What temp should I shoot for? How do I know it's done?

Teamfat was talking about an entirely different cut of meat. You will not be happy with a medium rare brisket. It's a barbecue axiom that, "Brisket needs to be cooked 'past well done and into tender.'" The correct internal temperature is 195F, plus or minus 5F. If you don't have a thermometer, the correct tests are the fork test and the bend test.

Fork test: Stick a fork in the meat -- if the meat is not only tender, but tender enough to turn the fork somewhat, it's done.

Bend test: Use your tongs to try and pick up the meat about an inch from one side. If the meat bends too much to pick up without breaking, it's done.

5. Why does it have to rest for sooo long?

The first half hour or so, completes the cooking process. The remaining time gives you slack with your party planning. Under no circumstances try to time a brisket within an hour -- or even two -- of your event. They will bite you in the behind every time. Also, the remaining time actually does improve the meat. Proteins finish denaturing, and temperatures fully equilibrate -- to give you the technical reasons.

6. I was overwhelmed with the bbq sauces on the store shelf. I don't know anything about them so what should I get if I want something not too sweet, a little tangy, with a little heat?

It's easy enough to make your own.

7. I don't want to jump the gun here, but once we're ready to eat do I slice across the grain?

You most certainly do. When the brisket is done, cut it in half, and take the first slice from middle. Check for tenderness, and that will tell you how thin to make your remaining slices. The tougher, the thinner. The more "falling apart" the thicker.

8. What's a bark... and a smoke ring?

The "bark" is the crust which forms on the surface of the meat from the smoke, the long cooking period, the "Maillard reaction," and the rub.

A smoke ring is a purplish ring just under the surface of the meat that extends about 1/4" into the interior -- it's formed by the interaction of smoke, myoglobins and (healthy) bacteria.

9. Can I stick my baked potatoes in there too or will they get smoky?

They will get smoky, but you can wrap them in foil.

Here's a very fundamental barbecue sauce recipe. You'll notice that it's a slightly tweaked, sweet and sour ketchup. Is that really all barbecue sauce is? Usually, yes. Can this be tweaked beyond all recognition? Yes.

First time Barbecue Sauce

2 cups ketchup
1 cup cider vinegar
1 cup honey
1/2 cup Worcestershire sauce
1/4 cup whole grain mustard (or regular yellow)
2 tbs soy sauce
(Optional) 2 or three dashes liquid smoke
Salt, black pepper and hot sauce to taste

Mix everything but the salt and peppers together and taste. Adjust the sweet and sour balance by adding more vinegar or honey. You said you liked more tang and less sweet -- here's your chance. Add salt if you feel it needs it -- you probably won't want much. Add enough black pepper so you can see a few flecks after you've stir it in.

Note 1: I know you like hot. Me too. But go easy on the hot sauce -- try and be sensitive to your most sensitive guest. You can always pass it on the side. People seem to like Texas Pete in your part of the country, but I suggest Tabasco Chipotle if you can find it.

Note 2: The liquid smoke is it's own issue. "Real" barbecuers won't even discuss it. It's like a religious thing. If you keep barbecuing you won't want it either. But for now ... everyone will be a lot happier if you put just a little in -- makes it taste like, well, barbecue sauce.

BDL

[Koukouvagia]

I'm nervous but I feel a lot more prepared. We're gonna give this a shot and whatever happens happens. I'm prepared for a 12 hour event minus the overnight marinading.

I will not mop or baste.

I will make my own bbq sauce and have it on the side. And yes I do have chipotle tobasco.

I will allow it to reach 195 and fork it and bend it before we pull it out.

As difficult as it may be I will let it rest in the foil for at least an hour before we start digging in.

I will scold anyone who says they're hungry before the brisket is ready.

Thank you for your help and suggestions. My expertise lies in greek cooking so if anyone ever needs help with that I'll be more than happy to lend my help!

[boar_d_laze]

Originally Posted by Mapiva

I'm nervous but I feel a lot more prepared. We're gonna give this a shot and whatever happens happens. I'm prepared for a 12 hour event minus the overnight marinading.

I will not mop or baste.

I will make my own bbq sauce and have it on the side. And yes I do have chipotle tobasco.

I will allow it to reach 195 and fork it and bend it before we pull it out.

As difficult as it may be I will let it rest in the foil for at least an hour before we start digging in.

I will scold anyone who says they're hungry before the brisket is ready.

Thank you for your help and suggestions. My expertise lies in greek cooking so if anyone ever needs help with that I'll be more than happy to lend my help!

You go girl!

If the thermometer says 195, don't bother with the other stuff. And remember, no peeking. If your husband wants to talk to me about the mods, PM me and we can arrange a phone "consultation."

It's been a long time since I had the opportunity to fool around with an ECB, even by long-distance proxy. Don't worry about any imposition, I consider it (a) fun; and (b) grist for the book.

Two enthusiastic briskets up,
BDL

[Koukouvagia]

Ok sorry, more questions.

Just looked at the smoker. It seems that the thermometer only has 3 settings, and doesn't specify degrees. It says only Low, Ideal, or High. Am I shooting for ideal?

Dumb question - where does the brisket go?? There are 2 racks, one right on top of the water pan, and one above that under the lid.

Do we add charcoal through the little door or lift the bullet completely?

When you say "don't open the door no matter what" which door do you mean? The lid? The little door on the front? don't lift the bullet?

I'm going to use one of the digital thermometers that is placed in the meat from the beginning and the cord extends out of the oven.

We will not undertake modifications THIS TIME but if this works out at all we will be upgrading.

[boar_d_laze]

Originally Posted by Mapiva

Ok sorry, more questions.

Just looked at the smoker. It seems that the thermometer only has 3 settings, and doesn't specify degrees. It says only Low, Ideal, or High. Am I shooting for ideal?

This time you're shooting for a temperature you can hold consistently as long as it's not all the way low or all the way hot. You can't really control that smoker very well -- especially without mods.

Next time you're shooting for a new thermometer, mounted in a different place.

Dumb question - where does the brisket go?? There are 2 racks, one right on top of the water pan, and one above that under the lid.

What's dumb about it? Use the top one this time. It will be easier to get to the meat when you absolutely have to.

Do we add charcoal through the little door or lift the bullet completely?

This time you add charcoal through the little door -- and good luck to you. For now IIRC, the lip of the fire pan sits on a ledge at the top of each leg. When you lift the bullet, you lift the pan as well. However, once you've done the mods, the fire pan will have it's own little stand and you'll be lifting the bullet off it to reload the pan. It makes a HUGE difference. Because you need to reload the pan frequently -- which is a difficult thing to do through that little door. So is refilling the water pan. (Hint: Line the pan with foil, and fill it with clean sand and you want to have reload the water pan.) Another fire pan modification allows the fire to breath better and you to clean out the ashes to keep them from choking the fire.

When you say "don't open the door no matter what" which door do you mean? The lid? The little door on the front? don't lift the bullet?

In the case of the bullet -- the lid, and the little door. You're going to have to open and/or to manage the fire, refill the water, and do what little tending the meat requires. Every time you let cool air in the pit, you dry out the meat and upset the rate at which the fire burns. That's why experienced pitmasters keep it to a minimum, and why the equipment is designed and built to minimize the disturbance.

I'm going to use one of the digital thermometers that is placed in the meat from the beginning and the cord extends out of the oven.

That is an incredibly good idea.

We will not undertake modifications THIS TIME but if this works out at all we will be upgrading.

If by upgrading you mean making the mods -- good idea. You can make an ECB work okay with those -- a lot less frustrating. You can actually make an ECB work reasonably well by gas-firing it with an Afterburner V or a tweaked turkey fryer burner.

If, by upgrading, you mean purchasing a WSM or some other better-than-an-ECB pit, that's cooler still. Once the pressure's off, you can figure out if that's really the best unit. And, if you're needs don't include a lot big entertaining, laid out slabs of ribs, or laid out large fish -- well, the only real limitations on the WSM are it's a little on the small side (about 18"), and mildly obnoxious to clean. Otherwise, $200 buys you close to $1,000 worth of performance.

If you do have that rib and/or fish thing, or you want another kind for whatever reason -- lots of good choices, and whatever you do decide on won't be a huge problem. You won't have to reinvent the wheel to make it work; all the ground has been plowed before.

Compared to almost any other culinary discipline smoking is extremely high reward, extremely high fun, for moderate effort. What's more, most of the effort is front loaded in terms of purchasing the right things (not that many) and making the right tweaks. If you like smoked food, and if you like outdoor cooking, you'll like smoking -- gay-ron-teed. You've set yourself a high first hurdle which you'll clear!. But even if this brisket is the worst ever (it won't be), don't give up on this part of the art. The food so good, the outdoors so pleasant, and my God, the aroma.

BDL

[MaryB]

I had a crew in trimming trees today by the power lines. They were downwind from 80 pounds of pork with the fat dripping on the tuning plates and burning off. They spent more time looking at the pit than working . I use the same type thermometer as you are planning to use. I had 8 butts on and just track the temp of two so I have a rough idea of whats going on. Been running the pit a tad hot today at 275 to get these done a little quicker. Three are off and three have a hour or so to go. That's a good example of how BBQ timing works, even the same size and shape hunk of meat can cook at a different pace than the others. The Big Drum Smoker is another option than the WSM and offers a larger cooking grate. Big Drum Smokers | BBQ Smokers more money but more cooking space. I started out using a Weber kettle, upgraded to a Brinkmann offset, then I bought the Klose. If I had stayed in catering I would be considering a bigger pit again .

[MikeLM]

My son in Reno bought the rinkydink Brinkmann a couple weeks ago, and we tried a brisket first thing- big mistake. Turned out very badly. I have used that model with the elctric element for quite a few years, with reasonably good results; never a brisket, though.

I've forwarded him a link to this thread.

A few years ago, driving from Houston to Chicago, we went about 300 miles out of our way to have lunch at Arthur Bryant's in KC. It was worth the trip.

The day after Bryant died, the KC Star editorial cartoon showed Bryant, a briefcase in his hand, trudging up a cloudy path toward the Pearly Gates. Saint Peter was running toward him, arms outstretched and beard flying in the wind. The caption was 'DID YOU BRING THE RECIPE?"

May I suggest my "famous" BBQ sauce. It is not sweet, and can be made as hot as you like:

MIKE'S FAMOUS, SECRET BARBECUE SAUCE
1 tsp salt
1 tsp chili powder
1 tsp celery seed (this is the secret ingredient)
1 tsp lemon zest
1 Tbsp brown sugar (or 2 Tbsp molasses or sorghum)
1/4 cup cider vinegar
1/4 cup Worcestershire sauce
1 cup tomato catsup (could use chili sauce)
2 cups water (or use 1 cup beer or red wine, 1 cup water)
3 cloves garlic, pressed (put the pulp in after pressing)
4 quarters fresh ginger (also pressed to extract juice- add this pulp also)
1 Tbsp Tobasco sauce
-or-
1/2 tsp red pepper flakes
or both, live dangerously

Mix all ingredients, simmer very slowly to reduce by one-third.
If you're smart you'll make a double recipe every time. Keeps very well frozen.
Believe it or not this started with a recipe in the Fanny Farmer Boston Cooking
School Cookbook, in an edition printed about 45 years ago!. The celery seeds
are the "secret" ingredient. Arthur Bryant's sauce uses them, too.
I added the garlic and ginger. If you add onions the sauce will get considerably sweeter

Enjoy

[Koukouvagia]

Originally Posted by MikeLM

My son in Reno bought the rinkydink Brinkmann a couple weeks ago, and we tried a brisket first thing- big mistake. Turned out very badly. I have used that model with the elctric element for quite a few years, with reasonably good results; never a brisket, though.

May I ask, what went so terribly wrong with the brisket? Was it the temperature control? What would you have done differently with this smoker if you were to do it again?

Thanks for the bbq sauce recipe!

[MikeLM]

Mapiva-
I think we botched the temperature- we were running around town and allowed the fire to die in the smoker. We were using hardwood charcoal and the flavor was sort of OK, but it was tough as a drill sargeant's boot. That's OK for a Missouri country ham, but not good in a brisket.

I would certainly go with BDL's physical modifications, and work your way up to brisket gradually.

I really hope you will give the sauce recipe a try. For about 25 years now, my kids won't accept anything else.

[Koukouvagia]

At 7:00 am we placed the marinaded and rubbed brisket in the chamber. We inserted a digital thermometer that measures both the internal temperature of the meat and the oven temp. For the past 45 minutes it has stayed a steady 281 in the oven so I will take that as a good sign that it's not all over the place... I'm hoping it will drop a little.

My husband is pacing about fretting and I need to keep an eye on him for fear of messing about with the charcoal.

It is what it is for now. More updates later.