How many food "specialties" are unknown in the country they're believed to come from?

[Britcook]

Originally posted by marmalady
And, although I've never read anything about it, my guess is that a lot of the 'Pennsylvania Dutch' and German recipes are those created here in the states by the German and Dutch immigrants, and are unknown in Holland and Germany. Hmmm, may have to make a trip to the library for this!

Certainly unknown in Holland as there are very few Dutch folk in Pennsylvania

IIRC the Dutch in "Pennsylvania Dutch" is an Americanization of Deutsch, in other words German.

[marmalady]

Beg to dfifer, Britcook, as I've met some!

[Pongi]

Rachel,
Actually Russian salad is a French dish.
It has been created by the French chef Jacques Olivier, who had been in the service of Czar Nicholas II.
After being escaped from Russia, he opened a restaurant in Wiesbaden (Germany) where invented the dish, naming it "Salade à la Russe" in honor of his former employer.
This is the reason why Russians call this dish "Olivier Salad" and NOT "Russian Salad"...
BTW, the original recipe is slightly different from the "basic" versions we usually have all around the world, calling also for roasted chicken cubes and (of course!) for sour cream in the sauce.

Something else?

Chicken Tikka Masala, one of the most popular "indian" dishes in Britain (Is it correct, Britcook?) is not really Indian. It has been invented in England by the indian immigrates to meet the European taste, adding a tomato sauce to the traditional indian chicken stews.

Another curiosity: as you know, Vitello Tonnato is an Italian dish. Probably some of you also know that it comes from Piemonte.
Well, many Italians believe that it's a French dish as in Italy it is often called "Vitel Tonnè"...very funny as this is not French (a real French name for the dish should be something like "Veau avec sauce de thon") but a mock French of obscure origin...surely NOT a Piemontese name

Pongi

[DaveB]

And then there's the concoction of rice, green peppers and tomato juice that's served as "Spanish Rice"...

[Pete]

Marmalady, though I am sure that there are some true "dutch" living in PA, the term Pennsylvania Dutch is, just like Britcook said, a bastardization of the word Duetsch. Many of the early settlers of Pennsylvania were of German origin, mostly from an area called the Lower Palantinate (which includes parts of the Lower Rhine, and some towns such as Bayern (sp?)). A large wave of these immigrants came starting in the late 1600's and through the 1730's, though the majority came in a span from about 1716 to 1739. These people were most often farmers (relatively poor and illiterate) who were escaping religious pursecution and war. These Germans boarded ships on the Rhine and went to either Holland or to England, from there they were sent to the New World, with ships landing all over the Eastern Seaboard, but especially heavily in Philadelphia. There these farmers moved into the surrounding countryside, with large groups settling in the places such as Bucks and Berks Counties and Northumberland (in the area of modern day Lancaster). These people Duetsch (German) in their language, but as often happens, outsiders heard it as Dutch and the name stuck.

[Britcook]

Pongi you are absolutely correct about Chicken Tikka Masala. The original Indian dish, Chicken Tikka, was considered too dry for British palates (they wanted some kind of "gravy" or sauce) so some of the stock sauce a tomato masala was added to moisten it. Now, although invented in Britain it has travelled back to the sub-continent and you can now get Tikka Masala inplaces like Bombay and Delhi.

While we're on the topic "curry" as such is unknown in India, they have specific dishes which we in the Western world tend to lump together as generic "curries". Although cuisine in the States varies a bit by geography - Southern, Californian, New England, Tex-Mex etc, in the sub-continent there many more different cuisines with quite different approaches to cooking.
True of Italy also from North to South.

One more food not found in its "home" is Spaghetti Bolognese, yes in Bologna they make the eponymous sauce but they would never dream of putting it on spaghetti but on ribbon noodles such as tagliatelle.

[Kimmie]

Britcook,

Their "Bolognese" is a lot thicker too, I mean a lot meatier.

[Pongi]

We had a funny thread about Ragù alla Bolognese some time ago.
As Kimmie said, the original "Bolognese" calls for a very small amount of tomato sauce, being a lot meatier than the American versions.
Generally speaking, I must say, all the American pasta sauces tend to contain too much tomato for the Italian palates...
Britcook, you're correct, formerly the Ragù alla Bolognese was intended to be served only with Tagliatelle or Lasagne. Afterwards it became so popular that now you can find it everywhere in Italy, served with any type of pasta, spaghetti and ravioli included...but it's an improper use (and also the sauce is often improper)
You're also right about Italy, our food cultures are so different from North to South that you could imagine to have a meal in different continents! We range from the Austrian-like cooking of Alto Adige from the Arab dishes (couscous included) of Sicily...

Pongi

[marmalady]

To Britcook and Pete -

Not to belabor a point, but---------

http://www.netherlands-embassy.org/c_townname.html

U.S. TOWNS AND CITIES WITH DUTCH NAMES
The Dutch West India Company settled a large parcel of land in the eastern United States, which in the 1600's became known as New Netherland. The borders of New Netherland would have stretched, in modern times, from southern Delaware through New Jersey and east-central Pennsylvania into eastern and central New York, including Long Island and Manhattan. The Dutch influence on these areas is still felt today, and many towns and cities in the U.S. were named after the towns from which the Dutch settlers had emigrated.


http://www.geocities.com/oldebucks/dutch.html

The Low Dutch Community
of Bucks County Pennsylvania

During the 15th and 16th centuries it was a common practice of the English to refer to all persons of Germanic heritage as "Dutch" or "Dutch-men", with the only occasional distinction made being that between "low" and "high". The term "Low" Dutch was sometimes used to signify those persons of Netherland-ish descent, while "High" Dutch referred to Germans and the Swiss. It was not until the latter part of the 17th century that the current distinction between Dutch and German began to come into use. Most of the "Dutch" settlers in southeastern Pennsylvania, including Bucks county, were in fact German. There was, however, a well established Low Dutch community in lower Bucks county. This community was comprised mainly of settlers and the descendants of settlers from the Netherlands, many of whom came into Pennsylvania through New Jersey from New York. It is in reference to these "Hollanders", rather than the German or "Pennsylvania Dutch" communities, that the term "Dutch" is applied throughout this site

[Isa]

Canadian Tart, a British speciality

[Britcook]

Well there you go Marmalady, I love it when these little snippets of info surface! I knew about New York formerly being Nieuw Amsterdam and the story of Peter Stuyvesant etc. I don't doubt the descendants of these early settlers are still around, but the German "Dutch" outnumber the Hollanders by a fair margin.

[marmalady]

Britcook, Didn't mean to sound as tho I was 'rubbing it in', but I knew Dutch folk when I was growing up in Pennsylvania - and also knew a lot of the town names, and such, as well as architecture, were Dutch in origin, not German.

You are right, tho, the German 'Pennsylvania Dutch' are much more common.

[momoreg]

...and I always thought they were Dutch.Thanks for the lesson, marm!

[Britcook]

No Marmalady, didn't feel I had been adversely rubbed, I find this "real" (people as opposed to battles and stuff) history fascinating. I've a great interest in Dutch stuff, and as a bit of a non-sequitur apparently the brickwork in our cellar is "Flemish bond", using the techniques of Huguenot settlers who manufactured bricks round here in the 18th century (cellar dates from around 1770, although the main house is "modern" dating from around 1823).