Shortening - ???

[lentil]

Thanks for the recipe! It looks delicious. Did you say the cake was a yellow one? Never mind, I'll go look in the previous posts. Thanks again.

[bubbamom]

Hi lentil, no, a white layer cake (two 8" pans for 4 cake layers). Just a hint, while the cannoli filling was good, it is dense and very rich so next time I make it, I'll cut back on the filling a bit either by making about one-fourth less or just using less as filling for this cake. Enjoy.

[boar_d_laze]

If you use a chocolate frosting fortified with espresso and a bit of booze, you might as well call it Cassata Siciliana.

BDL

[kokopuffs]

Boar D Laze states:

<<There's another type of lard sold, leaf lard. It's hard to find, costs more, comes from a different part of the animal, and must be rendered before using. Once rendered, it does the same thing. It is never hydrogenated.>>

Would you be referring to suet?

The following is slightly off-topic but I've heard some Brits state that for frying cod fish as in fish and chips, they prefer using lard as the frying medium.

[jbd]

Originally Posted by kokopuffs

Boar D Laze states:

<<There's another type of lard sold, leaf lard. It's hard to find, costs more, comes from a different part of the animal, and must be rendered before using. Once rendered, it does the same thing. It is never hydrogenated.>>

Would you be referring to suet?

Suet is fat from beef or sometimes mutton. Leaf lard is from hogs, and is found around the area of the kidneys. Its been many years since I have used it.

[kokopuffs]

Somewhere I read that suet is also found around the kidneys. Sounds to me like suet is the beef counterpart to leaf lard although it probably tastes and performs differently.

[qahtan]

Suet is great for some things, steak and kidney pudding and similar steamed
puddings.
It is by no means a substitute for lard......
Suet, you are right does come from around the kidneys.

qahtan

[boar_d_laze]

Originally Posted by kokopuffs

Would you be referring to suet?

No, I referred to leaf lard. Lard comes from swine, while suet comes from beef or mutton. Both leaf lard and suet are sourced from the loins and the area around the kidneys.

Hope this helps,
BDL

[Luc_H]

I think a little terminology is in order here:

Suet is fatty tissue found around the loins and kidneys of swine and mutton. It is actual fatty tissue which means it is not 100% fat. It contains some water, protein and mostly fat. In this form, this fatty product will turn brown when baked and cooked particularly when sugars are present (Maillard reaction) because of the presence of proteins.

Suet is slowly heated to render its fat content. The process is basically a fat extraction method. Rendered suet is called tallow and also lard. Tallow and lard are 100% fat like shortening.

Confusion: Leaf lard is occasionally used to describe suet (the fatty tissue around the loins and kidneys). Hence the confusion.

My suggestion above to use Ten_der_flake meant that since it is tallow it can be used as an alternate equivalent of hydrogenated vegetable oil Cris_co.

Luc H.

[boar_d_laze]

Luc,

As far as I know suet is taken from been and mutton only. Since reading your post I've done a quick Google as well as looked at my own cookbooks and can find no reference to suet from pig or other swine. On the other hand, as far as I know, lard refers to pork fat only. Ditto on research. I'm interested in reading other sources.

BDL

[Luc_H]

I concur about my reference mistake:
suet comes from Beef and mutton. (Something got mixed up in translation... I am French Canadian.. I regret)

Regardless...
Suet is fatty tissue and Tallow is rendered fat from suet. Tallow is comparable to shortening (not suet).

Lard is from pork. Lard is rendered fat. Again comparable to vegetable shortening.
Leaf Lard is fatty tissue. not the same fat as shortening.

This seems to be a good reference: Lard - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Luc H.

[boar_d_laze]

People who want the "finest" lard, buy leaf lard, then render it themselves.

As Luc just said, (and I said earlier, leaf lard is not lard per se, and requires rendering before being used for baking. At the time I didn't think it worth going into, but the rendering process requires filtering, and re-solidifying as well as melting.

When I render -- something I'm pretty much not willing to do anymore, I put the fat in warm water, then simmer the water away as the fat melts -- then filter as soon as the cracklings (if any there are) turn GBD. This seems to yield the cleanest product as well as the best cracklings. Finally I solidify the rendered and purified lard in the refrigerator. It's my experience that cold lard is the best lard when it comes to baking.

The question whether lard is a shortening replacement or vice versa depends on the particular recipe. But for classic baking purposes lard is the genuine article and vegetable shortening a modern imitation. It's worth noting also, that pure lard is, according to current medical dogma, considered healthier than vegetable shortening.

I've never noticed any meaty or bacon-y taste using lard for vegetable shortening -- but I use good lard. Farmer John brand, from the plastic tub to be specific. In fact, the taste difference between vegetable shortening and lard is (a) subtle, and (b) more an absence of shortening artifact in lard, than a detectable presence. "True dat" in baking and frying. The texture difference is far larger -- big advantage lard for lightness and flakiness.

However, to return to the actual theme of the thread ... vegetable shortening is a better stabilizing agent than lard. So for long shelf-life buttercream frostings, as for holiday cookies which sit out for a couple of days, it is preferred. Where stability was not at issue, butter would be the better choice. There's a reason it's called "buttercream," y'know.

A little perspective, here:

I'm not a particularly good baker -- and certainly not a pastry chef. I make decent simple breads, pastries, cakes, pies, tarts, crusts, etc., with the emphasis on simple. There are enormous limitations to my culinary knowledge and techniques -- most enormous in the pastry area.

If I have an overall concept (and I do, I do!) in contributing to this forum, it's trying to blend classic, French techniques with a modern aesthetic of simplicity. regional and ethnic foods, and reasonably available ingredients, while answering questions directly while presenting (if possible) explanations and options. I'd like you to have enough technique to be able to understand what you're about when you're cooking, to really enjoy it, and even to be able to improvise. I'm not trying to teach recipes.