Chef.... why? its not worth it!

[W.DeBord]

Regardless on the previous posts (because I understand your point)...I don't understand the "poking" at celebrity chefs? Yes I see the humor in the unrealistic simplifications and the sometimes silly style of their entertainment. But over all no one was noticing us until the celebrity chefs brought attention to us. There were always publications listing the top restaurants but no one really cared about them but "foodies". Now I beleive their the bigger selling issues for the magazines because customers want to eat at the better places. This of course goes hand and hand with the fact more people are eating out....

But where would we be with-out them? Now it's cool to become a chef. Even though tons of young adults are being mis-lead about the realities of the kitchen (also by sooking schools), they will be the ones who really make changes in this industry. Because it's becoming a profession, in the states it's never been a profession. People looked at us as we were working at restaurants on our way to our real job. I've had customers ask me what I was working toward...what profession? as if the job I was doing was temp.

Anyway old & wise your not talking about most kitchens, I've never seen one as progressive as you mention. The numbers are not shared, not obtainable for you to use. You must be kidding...thats management 101 "don't let people learn anything that they could use". Then you'd have to give them something in return and they'll just keep demanding more from you. Another lesson from class 101 never let them think their running their own department, that only leads to trouble. The less anyone knows, the less individualism happening the better and so it goes.......

[holydiver]

I like the food channel generally and I do respect a lot of the celebrity CChefs however I do think the channel is a promotion machine. It glosses over things they are always profiling some born with a silver spooon in their mouth chef oh I went to the best schools then I took 5 years to travel the world and eat in all the best restaurants then I came back and opened up my own 300 hundred seat 5 star restaurant with gold chandeliers. Then they pan to their house it's something out of mtv cribs some palatial mansion like where do these people get all this money?.

Exactly chefjohnpaul. Thats what I was trying to say. Thank you!I do believe I have managed to upset a lot of people with a very confusing post. I am NOT at all belittling the persons that I have mentioned before. I believe that they have helped chefs get the reconition that we deserve. I am not upset because "they are sucessful and I couldn't hack it", on the contery I have been very successfull at each position that I have held. I could not help that I burned out of the "formal dining" arena. But I was just trying to say that celebrity chefs and the food channel have given people the wrong impression of our industry. When they start cooking 50 gallons of stock and have Emeril plate for a party of 2000 I will change my mind.

[ August 03, 2001: Message edited by: ChefTiss ]

[panini]

HOLY SMOKES!!! As I read down through some of these posts I had to remind myself I was in the US.People.People. Remember: work to live, not live to work. I know it's a cleche but boy.
Anneka,Fried Parsley, "I'm not in it for the money"??????? Just because you are passionate about what you do does not mean you should be compensated.****, we are all in it for the money, that how the bills get paid, and that's how we enjoy our life outside of work. Money has never been an issue with the group of foodies I run with.If we are low on funds we work on the side, if business is slow we generate revenue by sales blitz's.There is so muck money out there, you just have to find it.ps people will thank you for giving it to them.

[Anneke]

Old&wise, please understand, I was on a consulting career path prior to this, both for the money and for respectability, and because I 'sort of' liked it. It's not that I don't like money (I do very much and Adam Smith is my friend) but I found that I was driven by something else much more powerful. When I say I'm not in it for money, let's just say that my earning potential will never be what it was as a consultant. I've come to terms with that. Don't misunderstand though, I plan to get every dime that I deserve and as much as I can possibly get. When I graduate, I plan to be a very valuable contributor to my job and my income had better reflect that. I'm not in it for charity and I don't think my posts ever suggested that. But if money was primarily what I wanted, I'd be doing something else...

[W.DeBord]

When money first became a topic you and others chimmed in that it about more than money. Uh ha, your a student, that explains alot more than you realize. Even though you had a former professional life this is a cross over for your dreams.

Your chasing a dream still....(I'm sorry I don't mean to offend you personally) After years of hard sweat and alot of cra* along the way you'll realize that even though your living your dream it doesn't make any sense that you had to scarafice so much to do it. No matter how much you love your work in time it's a job and you'll want the money and the respect you deserve for you efforts! That's so basic, it's respect and appreciation that money represents. It's grueling hard work with tons of scarafices attached that you and your family will pay. Its a very real mental and skill requiring job that in any other field this kind of work would pay double what any of us will ever make.

In some respects I wish the people chasing their dreams would do that at home so others who are truely professionals wouldn't have to compete with people that are willing to work for less then us. This groups is like home caters taking money out of licensed works hands or illegals aliens. It drives down the pay because there people willing to work for less then it takes to live.


P.S. "I plan to get every dime I deserve" good luck no one else does, that's the point!

[Greg]

Hmmm, I believe that right now I'm getting every dime I deserve, plus a little extra. I have a hard time believing I'm the only one. However, I'm sure that there are others in the industry who are not. I have no sympathy for them, however; it's their own personal choices and decisions that put them in that situation.

About management 101, the newer school of management is about communication and empowerment, not Machiavellian power games. If anybody ever finds themselves in that type of atmosphere, I suggest they get out as soon as possible.

Anneke, you've got the right attitude and pretty realistic expectations, I believe. If you go in believing that you can get paid your worth, you stand a much better chance of doing so. If you don't believe you can get paid what you're worth, it will become a self-fulfilling prophecy. It's all about karma...

[chefjohnpaul]

Chef Deboard makes a good point. If you are a fabulous chef that wows people with your culinary artistry, and they commend you on a fabulous meal that they are willing to pay handsomely for then the person that delivered it to their table makes twice as much an hour as you, eventually you begin to feel exploited.

Then on nights where you are cranking out the same frisee & confit salad to a hundred people then it becomes a pounding repitition
that is generating quite a bit of revenue that very little comes your way, and you don't even view it as a creative process at this point(a hundred frisee salads, a hundred cheeseburgers...).

I often spread a 5 course meal for family and friends with menus and the whole shabang and then sit eat and have a glass of wine with my guests, on an occasion like this all the compensation I need is their satisfied appetites and their warm friendship and the opportunity to share my passion with them. But when I'm on my feet busting it on the line for a business that is turning a profit, yeah, you bet I want compensation, $$$ for the caliber of work, fair hours that allows me to be with my family and have a life, and benefits that will allow me to have a certain peace of mind that my family is cared for, and it should be in conjunction with the $$$ the operation is bringing in. The bottom line is that it is a JOB, how ever much we love it, and jobs should care for our needs without sacrificing our lives.

[momoreg]

Never!!

[CampChef]

I worked for a chain for seven months a few years back. The money was incredible, but the work was soul ******* . The only reason most people were woking there was to move up the ladder. No one cared about the guests, it was all "me, me, me". I'm kind of surprised I lasted seven months there, but I'm also surprised I took it in the first place. I now find a job I want, and then work on the money.

[chefjohnpaul]

Oh, I agree Shroomgirl, I've turned down a number of things that may have been very lucrative because although they may not have been unethical but would have cut into my family and my ministry,(I believed I mentioned that I was a minister). It would be wrong to sell ones self out for $$$, how could you sleep at night?

But, one should not be exploited because they have a passion for something and would do it for 'free' so, 'let's see how little we can give em' and how much we can get out of em'!(I think the market does this in general because they can.) If one chooses to make less in order to contribute to an objective, hoorah! You are in control of that decision, it's not being forced upon you.

[shroomgirl]

I agree with Chefjohnpaul....a job should take care of your needs...Nicko and I discussed income, hours, passion and the various jobs we've done and the reasoning behind the changes we've each made. I have alturistic needs that most times out weigh $$. I could make alot more than I do but it would not satisfy my need to see local market places open up for farmers....live is not static. I have at times chosen to do less satisfying work for $ but then alter the game plan and work toward other lucrative venues that meet my "mission statement" if you will. I've recently found that one of my aquaintances is earning alot of money doing a program for a group that is gouging the people we work to support....I've not talked to him directly about it, but was dismayed when I found out... there's not enough money for me to cross my conscience. How about it? Would you take an extremely lucrative fairly easy gig for a group that goes against what you've espoused?

[GastroNaut]

Thanks everyone for your replies.... very interesting reading :-))

[Nick.Shu]

as a post script, i saw an advertisement for employment with no less than: jamie oliver.

fehh - unpaid secondment working beneath a home economist who is preparing for a tv chef?

talk about glorification - hee - "here is a dish i prepared earlier".

And for what? "i worked for jamie oliver!". i'd rather be trying to showcase my own abilities and skills rather than propping someone who couldnt even name the poisson de jour and potage de jour in the establishment that they are the executive consulting chef.

[Kimmie]

...and some clothes. Isn't he the Naked Chef?