the role of the pastry chef

Hi all,

I'm currently enrolled in a pastry program, with about 4 months left to go. I've been hearing lots of conflicting opinions about the importance of pastry chefs in restaurants and how their roles have changed in the past few years. Anyone have any insight they can share? Thanks for your help!

[monpetitchoux]

Hi and welcome to the site.

There's a book called something like Becoming a Pastry Chef that interviews lots of pastry chefs with a nice section that deals with your question. It's a good place to get opinions of more well-known pastry chefs.

I think there could be a lot of frustration in traditional restaurant kitchens for pastry chefs who have great ambition. We basically have to play second fiddle and tailor our desserts to flow with the cuisine of the restaurant. This means that a good working relationship between chef and pastry chef is very crucial to the success of the restaurant. And I think what makes a good relationship is when the chef and pastry chef each respect their boundaries but find some way to communicate.

But then there are chefs who refuse to share power and don't allow the pastry chef and the rest of the pastry kitchen to develop desserts that have a distinct personality yet flows with the cuisine. And then there are pastry chefs who are completley caught up in their style or teachings that they are not open-minded enough to take suggestions or lean in a new direction. This was the situation in the last place I worked. I think that many executive chefs are going to have to learn how to respect the pastry chef as a partner. Thus the pastry chef will ahve a vested interest in the establishment.

Pastries and pastry chefs are now earning more respect in the culinary world. There are well-known pastry and dessert chefs that have their own pastry shops with a few light savory options so that diners can have a meal but the pastries play the starring role. If it is in my destiny to have a place of my own, it will be like that or even better. It will be a place that offers dishes with the world of pastries completely integrated into the dish.

Good luck in your program.

[palmier]

All very good points. As a pastry chef, I was most comfortable in a restaurant when I had a good repore with the exec chef.

One more issue to ponder. When restaurants are not doing as well as budgeted, the first one to be considered to be cut are the pastry people. On two occasions in my career, I was let go because of budget cuts. Both were in big hotels.

[monpetitchoux]

Basically, that's what happened to me. The slow season hit us pretty hard here in Northern California, particularly with the big hike in utilities and right after taxes, too. So the Executive Chef (who's also part owner of the restaurant) got a severe case of the OMG Syndrome and started coming down really hard on me about the amount of overtime I do. It was only the pastry chef and me in the pastry kitchen in a high-end restaurant that had done over 300 covers on Fridays and Saturdays, 200 on other nights during the busy season. Desserts did close to 60% of covers on average. The chef paid me diddly to begin with. My overtime costs were only diddly times time and a half at about 10 hours of overtime a week. Well, the chef made it very difficult for me and the pastry chef to stay and easy for us to leave. The thing that incensed me the most was that the Executive Chef refused to come and see/taste and critique new dishes we wanted to put on the menus. Nor did he ever come and offer to help me or the pastry chef when it was only one of us in the pastry kitchen. He did not appreciate our work at all. Even under such circumstances, the Pastry Chef and I took ownership over our work and did our best daily. We did everything we could to lower food costs and upped the profits. We promoted the restaurant on our own time whenever we had the chance (cooking demonstrations, getting local farmers at the markets to mention how we used their products in the restaurant, etc). We knew that if the customers did not enjoy their dessert, whatever came before wouldn't matter. We did our best because we love our work. Even if we are not compensated well, at the very least, we deserve respect.

So if any one is looking to find the best worker your pastry kitchen ever saw, give me a ring.

[Pooh]

Monpetitchoux,

I know you will find a place deserving of you very soon!

BTW, how's The French Laundry doing?

[kokopuffs]

Mpchou:

Does Narsai's still operate a deli and restaurant in the Bay Area? I used to frequent their now-closed Deli in Kensington across the bay. Everything they offered was first class. However, my information is not current but I would seek Narsai's for employment advice.

[ May 24, 2001: Message edited by: kokopuffs ]

[W.DeBord]

Hi twosweebs again...aren't you discussing this at another site also? I hope you'll think about what people are telling you and then think about motives....

What do any of us professionals have to gain by telling the real negatives that exist in our profession? The answer is NOTHING, we don't fear new graduates. You aren't our competition, we need you.

Schools need YOU to make a profit (they are a business and you are their client)and many tell tall stories to keep their enrollment happening so they can stay in business and keep their jobs. Ask them how many of their students are employeed in this profession 10 years after graduation? If it's a good record they should have the numbers and brag about it. Read the fine print when they brag.


What's written in the pastry magazines....let's see, how do they make a profit...advertisements (who's buying the space)? They have to put a up beat spin on the market to keep the market buying. Think their going to say things stink right now? Then sales drop even more, will the pastry equipment company buy ad space in that kind of magazine? NO, then the magazine goes under! Who else advertises ALOT in these magazines...culinary schools (selling their product).

Prove us wrong, show us how things are better? Or do your homework and see how many pastry chef jobs are out there...just look on line.

Look, I love this business and can respect anyone else who does also. Just don't look at it thru rose colored glasses or be stupid enough to believe everything told you from people who profit from you following their advise.


It's a **** hard job market for pastry chefs and when you find a job the chef RARELY takes you in as his own, instead your the enemy.

[kokopuffs]

W DeBord:

Pastry chefs are the enemy of the head chef!?!?!? The same applies in my field of chiropractic - but worse. Every chiro is every other chiro's nightmare.

And yes, carefully examine in 10 years following graduation the school's statistics to see who is employed and where. 50% of those receiveing chiro diplomas are no longer practising 7 years after graduation.

[cape chef]

A chef must set the stage....cooridinate the flow and then hand off to the pastry chef, Who closes the show.
I feel it is my responsability as a Chef to understand the componets of the pastry chefs world...The more I understand baking,the better we can commencate
cc

[momoreg]

If the chef and pastry chef are enemies, something is VERY wrong there!!

You've got to be on the same wavelength; understand each others' food, and way of presenting it. You may not always agree, but you have to be allies.

[angrychef]

I used to work as a pastry chef in a restaurant and really did not enjoy the experience. It's true about what everyone's said, first sign of financial trouble and the pastry department suffers. I've been working at bakeries and catering companies ever since. I have to say that what is nice about working in a bakery is that it's all pastry, no hot side of the kitchen to deal with and no arguments with the exec. chef. Now I'm in catering and I'm lucky enough where the chef and I see eye to eye and can discuss garnishing, plating, etc. on a very creative and helpful level. Drawback is I don't have complete total control of the menu(the dessert part) when sales managers do their proposals.

[Eeyore]

I hate to bring an old but sore topic back up but I just quit my job and I feel like venting!

I work in a small country club. I'm the only one on pastries and I do all the wedding cakes ( and grooms cakes) because they wont allow brides to bring them in.

Im working far more hours than I agreed to and at that Im just barely getting by. I always have several balls in the air and Im always afraid one is going to drop. When I make ganache I cant stay and watch the cream...waiting for it to boil. I watch the guys on the hot side and Im jealous. They can just stand at the grill and watch the meat cook. Or stand and slowly peal potatoes. Im in 5th gear all the time.

And then if I have something in a bowl one of them would like to use they just say: Your going to have to do something with this because I need this bowl. Or worse they just dump it themselves into something. Same thing with sheet pans or hotel pans. If Im using something it is never as important as when they need it. Oh wait I said it wrong...they say: "honey, your going to have to do something with this stuff, I need this pan" I feel like the red-headed step child.

So I told the manager that I would like them to hire an apprentice to help me. She said "I really dont want to devide the work between 2 people--there could start to be alot of bickering" I said "well you always have around 4 people on the hot side cooking for the same amount of people I am" she said, "yeah and they bicker alot"

sigh

Oh well,

Im gone now!!

eeyore

[Svadhisthana]

Good luck, I hope you find something better soon. Doesn't it feel gooooood to vent.......?

[momoreg]

Eeyore,

I understand, and congratulate you! Something better is always on the horizon.

PS- I just gave notice at my job too, after 5 years.

[Eeyore]

Heehee! yes it feels great!

Momoreg, we should have a party. WOOHOO!


thanx you guys.
eeyore

I am right tho' ? right?

[ July 01, 2001: Message edited by: Eeyore ]