the role of the pastry chef

[W.DeBord]

I'm running late for work so I can't write much....BOY do I hear you! Momoreg knows. Much to talk about........I've had them cave in to my demands for an assistant, plus I have my own pans etc....but still there are so many small jealousys' and so much torture the chef sets up for me. I also have been ready to quit for awhile now.

I'd like to talk about this subject from a educational perspective (how not to run into this again) if we can? How to interview at a new place and see the warning signs or talk about the possible problems with a new chef before things go bad. I saw all the warning signs before I took my position....I took it as a temp. position (they didn't know I wasen't planning on staying) while I was waiting for something else that was promised to happen (it didn't happen and I've stayed along time in a known bad enviroment). Now I want to move on and try to find the right place...I'd love to talk more.....I'll be back tommarrow.

[momoreg]

I was called "honey" repeatedly throughout my interview.

I was told that the reason my previous boss went out of business was because of my salary.

As a salaried employee, I still receieved no medical benefits for 6 months.

There were thousands of signs, but those were the very first.

[thebighat]

Reading this thread brings me a huge feeling of gratitude for the well-run place I work at. I've worked at many places that sound eerily familiar to what I'm reading here,and would leave the business and do something else rather than put up with what some of you describe.

[W.DeBord]

When he interviewed me (which wasen't an interview, it was just to see if I was breathing cause they would have took anyone) the chef said over and over "I don't know why the pastry chefs never stay here, I don't know why they leave...". He told me tooooo much history about nothing, the job decription never came close to matching my actual work. I can't even begin to understand his interview techinque, it was history...nothing to do with todays reality. Three hours of the same things repeated and repeated until I could barely fake interest.

He told me only one guy in the kitchen didn't speak english but other wise language wouldn't be a problem, at all. He forgot to explain that I would never be spoken to, there would never be any discusions in English. My co-workers would never relate to me since I'm a female and never make any attempt to get to know me.


I brought photos and he glanced at them ever so briefly. Totally dismissing them. (He didn't even remotely understand what I was showing him.) At first he forbid me from making show pieces because "they take too long"....(I'm like HUH?) then I heard the stories of how previous pastry chefs took months for one piece. So I made mine in a couple hours and everyone got excited....that was the beginning of the end...I could see it on his face.

[W.DeBord]

Ever daydream about your next job interview....I do all the time. I wish I could talk about how to work with a pastry chef as far as what to expect in regards to volume, timing, assistance, equpiment etc...all the things you know will become issues...but you can't. Find out if the Chef really loves to cook and if they do anything creative. Is the guy an ego maniac, can he deal with a strong female?

I'd like to take the sous chef out to dinner and ask him what the real deal is on how the people interact, how the chef is when he's not on his best behavior. I'd like to know who gets paid what and how much work they do and what the quality of their work is like before I blindly negociate my pay.

Then I'd like to sit in the back of the kitchen for a week or two (free) and watch the dynamics before I deside to jump in with both feet.

Just dreamin......

hi i am also in a pastry program the only difference is i have 9 more months to go insteadof 4 months do you have anything on the history of pastrychefs or know how i can find the info on the internet if you do please let me know thanks littlebit

[monpetitchoux]

So I'll be starting a new job on Monday. I'll be working with the same pastry chef again, as we applied as a pastry chef and assistant team. During the initial interview, I seized the opportunity to ask the host questions (turnover, what's so great/not so great about working at this place, layoffs during the slow season, etc.) just to get another perspective on things. During the interview with the chef, I asked why the current pastry chef was leaving and why the restaurant has not able to retain assistants, though this wasn't really an issue. But it was a great way for me to get the head chef to tell me how much he was paying the previous assistants. But he beat me to it and offered a starting rate, which I refused. I asked for something that would make me happy just on the lark that he might agree. But I also backed up my request with solid expectable outcomes on my end. When he offered the job, he started me at what I asked for. To test the waters, the pastry chef suggested that they allow us to audition to demonstrate a few of our desserts. This gave us a chance to see how we would interact with the current staff and to ask more questions of people who were not in charge. Also gave us a chance to see what equipment is available and what we would have to change. Then we were able to negotiate the terms of employment with the chef when he offered the job.

[kuan]

I am glad things worked out for you monpetitchoux. I wish you the best of luck. The pastry department seems to be the most misunderstood of all. Even some who claim to be "Executive Chef" have a difficult time understanding the role of the pastry chef. (not that they would admit it ) This is not just restricted to the culinary profession though. My wife has a Ph.D in Food Science. We interviewed a lot before we settled on Minneapolis. Most of the interviews required nothing more than a person with a two year technical degree. One wonders why they even bothered to call her.

Positions which fully utilize a pastry chef's full skillset are few and far between. It's too bad that sometimes we have to just take the first job that comes around. I've made that mistake a few times. This is a drawback of doing things the old way where there is only one voice which matters in the kitchen. The restaurant industry needs to look at other industries where every worker is empowered to do the best they can. Personal responsibility and accountability are de riguer nowadays for even the lowest line level worker. Workers take ownership over what they do and as a consequence, they do it better. I firmly believe this is the way to go if we are to improve our quality of life in the kitchen.

Kuan

[kuan]

DeBord brings up a good point. But if we could sit in a kitchen and watch the dynamics for a coupla weeks, and assuming we all were sane, we wouldn't be in the business! Seriously, I've walked into some kitchens where you could immediately tell that it wasn't working. Then again, there are some places which give you a good feeling as soon as you walk in the door. Is that like love at first sight?

Kuan

[pastrychef_den]

Hello everyone...

I have worked in a place which had a very high staff turnover history (about 25 in 24 months). I was shocked when I learned about that but though of it as a learning thing and how far I'd go. I kinda took the job with a goal in mind. That is, to learn as much as I can and slowly build my own techniques through time. I also made it a point that I will be selective of all the traits that I will take with me. You know, leave the bad ones with the establishment and take the good ones with you...

The job was pretty tough but the training was great, it was like a 12 hour job fitted to an 8 hour shift. I guess it depends on how you look at it. I have considered quitting so many times but I told myself that if I can stay for more than a year, I'd be able to work anywhere. I think sometimes we have to make sacrifices to achieve our goals. The pastry chef was great, talented and very nice but the other higher ups were not as sensitive to the needs of the staff. They wanted to keep you but are not willing to meet half way with your needs. The funny thing is that they recognize the talent but they are not willing to compromise. I don't understand that belief at all. I decided to leave midway after my first year with no regrets whatsoever. I've got good offers after working in that place but I had to weigh things and make sure that I will work comfortably with my new job. I've learned many things with the pastry chef and will carry those informations with me and teach them to my future subordinates.

To sum it all up. I think that the management should be sensitive to the needs of the ones who really do the job. My advice is if you find a really good individual in your pastry kitchen, try to nurture and take care of the person because skilled and knowledgeable individuals are hard to come by these days. Also, respect is something that is earned and not demanded from other people.

I hope this is not too long. Have a great weekend...

Carme, Marie-Antoine
b. June 8, 1784, Paris, France
d. Jan. 12, 1833, Paris
byname ANTONIN, chef who served the royalty of Europe and wrote several classics of cuisine.
Antonin was born into a poor family. He began his career at age 15 as a kitchen helper in a Parisian restaurant but soon moved to employment in a fashionable pastry shop, or pâtisserie, frequented by Charles-Maurice de Talleyrand. Carême's elaborately sculptured confections reached the table of Napoleon himself. Carême thereafter became the chef of Talleyrand (12 years), of the prince regent (the future George IV) of Great Britain (2 years), and briefly, in succession, of Tsar Alexander I of Russia, the court of Vienna, the British embassy in Paris, the Prince of Württemberg, the Marquess of Londonderry, and the Princess Bagration. He then spent 7 years with the Baron de Rothschild at his Ferrières estate.

His cuisine was famous for its decorative and elaborate display, approaching the grandiose, fitting for the old society of Europe. His chief works include Le Cuisinier parisien ou l'art de la cuisine française au XIXe siècle (1828; "The Parisian Cook, or the Art of French Cooking in the 19th Century"), Le Patissier royal parisien (1828; "The Royal Parisian Pastry-Chef"), L'Art de la cuisine française au XIXe siècle (1833; "The Art of French Cooking in the 19th Century"), Le Patissier pittoresque (1842; "The Picturesque Pastry-Chef"), and Le Maitre d'hotel français, traité des menus à servir à Paris, à Saint-Pétersbourg, à Londres, à Vienne (1820; "The French Head Waiter: A Selection of Menus to Serve in Paris, Saint Petersburg, London, and Vienna").

[ShawtyCat]

If someone here has an assistant..please tell me how to get one. I know exactly what you mean about people wanting your bowls and hotel pans but at least they ask you first. The kitchen elves keep taking mine. I remember a few months ago someone used my knife (the one I personally own) to do something with chicken and the reason I know it was chicken is because it still smelt like chicken.

I asked for an assistant to help me out since I was working 14 hours baking cheesecakes, cakes, cookies, brownies, puddings, etc. So I feel you when you talk about not being able to watch the cream come to a boil. My hubby suggested that his mom and I bake together. God Forbid! The lady puts vanilla crystals (yes ...vanilla crystals!) in the cakes instead of vanilla extract. The last time we ran out of Vanilla Extract and she took that vanilla syrup you use to make vanilla milkshakes and used that instead. The lady takes cost cutting to the extreme.

Im suffering from Pastry Back & Knees syndrome. You know..when you get done with the shift after prepping and baking everything yourself..then plating a few orders. And when you get home you notice that every time you move your back and knees creak? I always wish I could be glued to my bed.

Jodi