[crimsonmist308]

OK, so i went to a CF last week, but that is because my boss paid for it.
the portions are huge, and the meal was tasty.

i had the bbq beef ribs and they were fall off the bone tender, altho a
little heavy on the sauce. the fries were thin, light and crisp, and the
fried onion "strings" were crispy and not at all oily like battered onion
rings usually are.

give any ingredient to a few cooks/chefs and they will all be slightly different because of timing, heat, etc. such is life with a lot of "chains" as well. the better ones are more consistant.

maybe here is a perspective on eating food ... even from someplace like CF (altho it is nowhere near as bad as a lot of places i have been to and, in fact, i enjoyed my ribs).

my brother-in-law, quite the cook, was on a plane flight back from europe and who was flying on the same flight?? jacques pepin, as celebrated a chef as there ever was (to a lot of people!), sitting across the aisle from him.
when the in-flight meal was served (this was in business class, NOT first class!!). i asked (remember ... this is airline food!!) my brother-in-law if jacques pepin bothered to eat the food.

my brother-in-law answered " .... like it was his last meal!!"

[Mezzaluna]

I don't recognize the name of the restaurant.....??

[crimsonmist308]

Originally Posted by Mezzaluna

I don't recognize the name of the restaurant.....??

OH!!

we were talking about CheesecakeFactory. sorry for the confusion!

[lentil]

The thing with chains of any kind- Lowe's, Macy's, Applebees- any kind at all, is that each time one opens, we flock to them like flies....or sheep, to the detriment of individually owned businesses. I'm tired of corporate America telling me what I should eat, wear, put in my house. I'd rather eat at a privately owned restaurant and take my chances than eat at a chain and get the same food in NH as you'd get anywhere else in the free world.

[foodnfoto]

I recently had a job styling slices of their cheesecakes for the packaging of their frozen retail offerings. These were some very tasty cheescakes! It's not even one of my favorite desserts, but these were really yummy!

Haven't eaten at their restos, so I couldn't comment. The people in charge of the whole thing were very nice. They were easy to get along with, clear and communicative about their goals. I like that.

[crimsonmist308]

Originally Posted by lentil

The thing with chains of any kind- Lowe's, Macy's, Applebees- any kind at all, is that each time one opens, we flock to them like flies....or sheep, to the detriment of individually owned businesses. I'm tired of corporate America telling me what I should eat, wear, put in my house. I'd rather eat at a privately owned restaurant and take my chances than eat at a chain and get the same food in NH as you'd get anywhere else in the free world.

I felt the same way when i had a four hour layover in hawaii when i was en route to midway island ...
we took a taxi downtown and what were our restaurant choices?? mickey d,
burger king, tgif, denny's, chain after chain. unfortunately,
knowing EXACTLY what the food will be like is a source of comfort for a lot of people. generally speaking, a chain or franchise is some sort of comfort in the sanitation department as well. a chain/franchise is almost a guarantee of being a money maker .... a plus when you consider what real estate rentals are going for!
you just have to watch "kitchen nightmares" on tv and just imagine how
icky the average restaurant could be ... especially in a city you know nothing about.
i am a big fan of hole-in-the-walls. "drive-ins, diners, and dives" on
food networks really stokes my fires!! so many great food ideas!

[Cat Man]

I've eaten at several CF's over the years.
I also spent several years working for a casual dining chain that competes with them on certain levels.

My first CF experience was many years ago in LA. Specifiaclly, Marina Del Ray location. I lived on a sailboat in the marina at the time, and was able to take the dingy there, since they had a dingy dock for marina residents. To me, at the time....that was part of the 'experience'.
I've seen that unit on a 2 hour wait for LUNCH ON A WEEKDAY!!!!
I've also heard that unit has done over $20 million in sales in one year. To execute those kind of sales and have people come back, is an accomplishment that we should all admire....regardless of whether you like chains or not.

Someone mentioned the Dallas location. I ate there about a year ago, with a large group. That particular location intrigued me because of the location, evironment etc...
I was shocked at the sheer size and grandeur. I figured the buildout must have been at least $10 million......I was then informed of how much TI they received from the landlord, because of it's flagship status. Almost half the entire buildout!!!

That, my friends, is very impressive to me. When a commercial landlord gives you $5 million bucks to build you restaurant....you are on to something.

The service?...okay..nothing memorable, either way, and I'm not sure that's a bad thing.

The menu?....way too extensive for me...I prefer simple, but they do seem to have something for everyone.....reminds me of a glorified TGIF to a certain degree.

The food?....met my expectations but did not exceed them. That too is okay for me...especially with a large group (75+).

The strange thing is....I would never even consider taking my family there for dinner.....but I would entertain business clients there, without even thinking about it much.

It is what it is.....a success story in casual dining.

Cat Man

[lentil]

Originally Posted by crimsonmist308

I felt the same way when i had a four hour layover in hawaii when i was en route to midway island ...
we took a taxi downtown and what were our restaurant choices?? mickey d,
burger king, tgif, denny's, chain after chain. unfortunately,
knowing EXACTLY what the food will be like is a source of comfort for a lot of people. generally speaking, a chain or franchise is some sort of comfort in the sanitation department as well. a chain/franchise is almost a guarantee of being a money maker .... a plus when you consider what real estate rentals are going for!
you just have to watch "kitchen nightmares" on tv and just imagine how
icky the average restaurant could be ... especially in a city you know nothing about.
i am a big fan of hole-in-the-walls. "drive-ins, diners, and dives" on
food networks really stokes my fires!! so many great food ideas!

Comfort, sure, I get that, especially in a strange city, but in general, I think we've just become used to having corporate America make our choices for us. The chains have the $$ to get prime real estate so they put their businesses near where people are- at the malls- and we are too lazy to venture off even 1/2 mile to find something different.

Our bellies have been trained to expect a monster burger from Ruby Tuesday's and should we end up in a mom and pop diner and get a normal sized one, we feel cheated. The diner doesn't have the buying power to get burger cheap enough to make a half pounder, serve it with a load of fries, and a salad bar for only $2.99 extra. Chances are, they're not even in a location that would get enough traffic to sell enough of them to break even.

This is a topic that really interests me, but I've got to my high schooler to his ride to school and get myself to work.

[Montelago]

On a similar note, TCF owns a chain of higher end restaurants called Grand Lux Cafe that is growing by leaps and bounds. It is a very nice, well appointed concept that has very good quality food. Nothing frilly or pretentious, but something for everyone. What's more, the Grand Lux at the Venetian in Vegas is the second busiest restaurant in the world. Last year they topped 120 million in sales. They have over 360 employees, run 24 hours a day and serve on average 5-7 thousand covers per day. And they do it well. Very short waits, fast service and good food. This just speaks to the organization of the company, the system and the management. Oh yea, and with the exception of the cheesecakes which come from corporate, everything is made from scratch. This restaurant does a la carte, they have an in house express breakfast and lunch buffet, a bakery that sells carry out goods and coffee, a pizzeria section and a hot line that is about 100 feet long staffed by 20 line cooks. It is worth touring just to see the operation, even if you don't want to eat there.

[lentil]

Montelago, I had a trip planned this month to LV for a conference, but in the end couldn't justify the $$. I would have liked to have seen the place you talked about. Sounds interesting.

I don't begrudge anyone who's working in a chain. In fact, I worked for Holiday Inn Corp for a few years. It was how I was able to do a lot of travelling, knowing I was assured of a job when I got someplace.

My (quasi) stand against chains won't amount to a hill of beans anyway. There will always be a line out the door of most chains for all the reasons posted above: consistency, name recognition, food safety (or the illusion of same), placement of restaurants... Their $$ spent on marketing to the masses far surpass that of most, if not all, privately owned establishments. I know that they're willing to pay top dollar for real estate in high traffic areas like around malls which has raised the value of land in those areas, and imagine they've done the same to leases inside malls. If McD's is willing to pay $3K (and I'm guessing here) for a space, my little cafe wouldn't be able to match that. I pay $800 for 600 sq ft! A bargain until you see my heating bill and realize that we have to wear layers in the kitchen because there's no heat there- only what drifts in from the front or what comes off the ovens. I had plants freeze in there. Hot as Hades in the summer, too. My baker complains about the cold; just wait until she experiences August! I keep telling the landlord that a little insulation in the ceiling would do wonders...

[crimsonmist308]

Originally Posted by lentil

. If McD's is willing to pay $3K (and I'm guessing here) for a space, my little cafe wouldn't be able to match that. I pay $800 for 600 sq ft! A bargain until you see my heating bill and realize that we have to wear layers in the kitchen because there's no heat there- only what drifts in from the front or what comes off the ovens. .

$800/month?? how much is the heating bill??

compare your $800 for 600 sq. ft. to san francisco's outrageous rent of
(on the average for a good not prime location) $5.00/sq. ft.!!
your little 600 sq. ft. restaurant would be costing $3,000/month BEFORE
heating, gas, electricity, et. al.!!

no wonder there is such a high failure rate in this town ... and now, by city law, owners have to provide a health plan, paid sick leave, and a $9.00/hr.
minimum wage!

[lentil]

HA! Crimson, my space is layed out so poorly, you wouldn't believe it! The building is OLD!!! It used to be 3 units connected end to end approx 10-12 feet in width by 60 feet in length total, so it's sort of like 3 train cars. The first unit has my office, catering storage, and dry good storage as well as a fridge and a freezer, no insulation and a monitor heater. When I sit at my desk, I can feel a breeze at my feet and ...no lie, either, my hair ruffles when it's windy. The second unit is my kitchen sans sink and refrigeration. I have 2 freezers, a conv oven, a regular house type stove, food prep sink and 2 hand sinks as well as 4 stainless tables and shelving. We're very cramped, but need everything in there for a baking area, sandwich prep, and general prep. The third unit is divided up into a tiny sitting/retail area with a bakery case and beverage cooler the rest is for the 3 bay sink, 2 door commercial fridge, and small counter for coffee and soup. This unit has another monitor heater. There are tables on the porch and picnic tables on the lawn. for a total of about 20 seats.

When I started, I was mainly catering and take-home meal prep. The tiny cafe/take out is an afterthought, but is my bread and butter during the off months for catering. I'd invest more $$ knowing what I know now and probably put the cafe in the front part (with insulation, a new floor, and a door that actually opens and closes without swearing and banging of course) keep the kitchen in the middle and use the back for storage/office/3 bay/refrigeration.

Heat is about $375/month and elect is $225 for a total of about $1400/month in the winter months. And, in case you hadn't heard, we're having our first real winter in years this year! I've spent $800 in heat alone since 12-7-07. I love winter, but my checking account is suffering.

Sorry, that was long winded..

[iswhaticrave]

I am usually not a big fan of chain restaurants as they seem to all serve the same dishes. My in-laws however, love to go out to eat, often to places such as CF. Last time I was there, we had a roasted artichoke, served with a garlic sauce. It was absolutely grand.

[bubbamom]

Seems to me that they wouldn't be a "chain" restaurant if their food wasn't considered, by and large, pretty good. IMHO it's not a gourmet restaurant, but on the other hand, it's not a dive either. Go, try it, and hopefully enjoy. After all, if you don't like it, you never have to go back again.

[ajoe]

Originally Posted by lentil

...Our bellies have been trained to expect a monster burger from Ruby Tuesday's and should we end up in a mom and pop diner and get a normal sized one, we feel cheated....

I disagree on this point. I am turned off by places that insist on providing monster portions.

I don't want to take food home after a meal, and I don't want to waste food. I may be in the minority, but if a place insists on serving me more food than I want (most chains do), I probably won't return.