"adult fast food"

[roflcopter]

why do people that consider themselves "foodies" always knock places like olive garden and applebee's...sure, nobody's in the back rolling out their fresh pasta dough or breading all those wonderful little fried apps, and service is probably spotty at best for most of these types of places...but you gotta admit, the food is always good. if you order lasagna, it's going to taste like good lasagna. that's always been my experience, anyway...

this subject comes up at school sometimes...i get told that i need to "expand my horizons" or something overly philosophical like that. to me, turning your nose up at places like that seems pretentious.

[shroomgirl]

making an assumption, but if you are in school your probably young.....for many of us that have been around long enough to give birth to someone in their twenties and have cooked as well as eaten throughout the US +.....we've got some experience with restaurants/cooking other than Olive Garden etc.

Do they have a following? sure.

Would it behoove those of us to cook to see what/how they market themselves? sure.

Is there value in working in a fast food place? absolutely.

Is there a difference in quality of food, between chains and independant restaurants who source local and butcher their own product? YEAH there is.

If your experience says Olive Garden has good lasagna, that's super. You are in luck every where you travel. Some of us prefer to explore other options.

[KYHeirloomer]

Unfortunately this isn't true.

From site to site there can be, and often are, inconsistencies in how the food is prepared. Most people I know familiar with Cracker Barrels, for instance, find the one in Marietta disappointing.

And even at the same site, there can be problems---either because the staff isn't familiar with preparing the item, or the chain's orientation has changed, or because it's Sunday, or half a dozen other possible reasons.

F'rinstance, you mention Applebees specifically. Have you tried their riblets lately? When a chain can't make its own signature dish well you have to wonder about the rest of the menu.

Nor is economics a factor. The fact is, these casual dining chains aren't exactly cheap. I can, for instance, dine at most independent restaurants in this area less expensively than Outback, and get both better food and better service.

Thus, there are all sorts of reasons to not choose these chains. I don't think foodie snobbery enters into it at all.

[Jim]

The food can be so asceptic from one chain establishment to the next, the idea of expanding your horizons means that lasagna can be good, but how about trying the Rombo en Guazzetto alla Romano. In other words, it is not the elevation of one within the food chain social order, rather the wanton desire to eat better.

[GhettoRacingKid]

Olive Garden Ick, Fake Italian food or Fast Food Italian style.

I see you in Ohio. Im not knocking ohio but im sorry but that is not real italian or i guess you can say "NY Italian" food. If you ever come to NY and go into little italy or around the city you will see the difference. trust me on that one.

While places liek those arent bad so to say they ahve there ups and down and cost is an issue.

It has a comfort feel of food you know and what not like chicken finger, buffalo wings and its pretty consistant from place to place and town to town.

Going out and expericing how other people and place do certain things is what expanding you horizons is meant by.

im sorry if this post made no sense. bad day in the good old IT world for the best company ever (sarcastic)

[Jim]

Im not knocking ohio but im sorry but that is not real italian

That's probably a bit of an overstatement, don't you think? There is NOBODY of the 11,000,000 people (7th largest population in the country)that reside in Ohio that are capable of delivering some amazing Italian fare? How do you figure? I am not trying to go on an offensive (and no, I am not running for governor of Ohio), but I think this type of erroneous locution is to what, I believe, 'roflcopter' was referring.

[GhettoRacingKid]

I did say NY italian afterwards.

I know that good food can be produced anywhere no matter where it is. but ive had olive gardens lasanga and yeah im not a fan. there salad and breadsticks are good though.

[iswhaticrave]

That's the thing. If you are traveling and looking to be safe in what you eat, yes you know exactly what you are going to get when you go to Olive Garden, Applebees, etc. But, I think lots of people like to try the "local flavor" of a place, especially overseas. But even in the States, this "ohio italian" vs. "NY italian." Sure the places in Little Italy are absolutely wonderful...but that does not mean there aren't many delicious Italian places in Ohio as well!

[firerose0801]

While I am no fan of any of the chains like Olive Garden, Applebees, etc, you have to admit that they make it much easier to agree on a place when going out with a large group of people (or a group made up of several generations, we always go to Outback when it's my grandma, my parents, my cousin and her kids, etc...it just makes life easier). There is usually bound to be at least one thing on the menu that everyone will be able to eat. I think that those restaurants have some value (albeit, not necessarily for the food...) and I do think that it is kind of snobby to completely disregard them.

[boar_d_laze]

Originally Posted by roflcopter

why do people [snip] knock places like olive garden and applebee's

Because the food isn't very good. It's "dumbed down" so as to offend no one and appeal to the lowest common denominator. They're safe.

but you gotta admit, the food is always good. if you order lasagna, it's going to taste like good lasagna. that's always been my experience, anyway

.
Not only do I not admit, J'accuse! Better than Stouffers is not the same thing as good. Neither is safe.

this subject comes up at school sometimes...i get told that i need to "expand my horizons" or something overly philosophical like that. to me, turning your nose up at places like that seems pretentious.

I don't know abut your horizons, but if you're planning to go into "fine dining," you need to develop your palate. That's not philosophical, that's learning how to cook. Listen.

BDL

[roflcopter]

i want to clarify a bit.

i never said that type of restauraunt is on the same level as a fine dining establishment.

i never said that it's "authentic" or anything even close that.

i've never worked (nor have any interest in working) in such an establishment.

the only thing i was trying to point out is that a lot of people totally write that type of place off, when it's better than going to a waffle house or taco bell or something.

[RPMcMurphy]

Originally Posted by roflcopter

the only thing i was trying to point out is that a lot of people totally write that type of place off, when it's better than going to a waffle house or taco bell or something.

there are so many other restaurants much better in my area, some for even cheaper prices, that yeah, I totally write off the adult fast food as much as I can. I have that luxury.

[boar_d_laze]

roflcopter, young Padwan,

I'm not beating you up or even arguing with you. Only trying to point things out from a different perspective.

Originally Posted by roflcopter

i never said that type of restauraunt is on the same level as a fine dining establishment.

What you said was: "...if you order lasagna, it's going to taste like good lasagna..."

The pasta example is a good one, because Olive Garden is a little easier to analyze than Appleby's. One thing you can count on, the pasta at Olive Garden is overcooked.

Why? Because Olive Garden plays it safe. Americans are used to overcooked pasta. OG know they'll offend fewer people by slightly overcooking rather than undercooking. So, they establish the standard as slightly overcooked, and set the timers accordingly. That way, in thousands of restaurants across the country, it's almost never undercooked. Every night, hundreds of thousands of people eat pasta that sticks to their teeth. Even though those people are happy, doesn't make the pasta good, right or well cooked.

Some of the confusion comes from the fact that in much of America, OG is the special restaurant. It's where people go for engagements, graduations, life events. It's a favorite restaurant. People want their recipes so they can make their loved ones' favorite dishes. The social phenomenon doesn't make the food good or bad. It's entirely irrelevant. We're not talking about diners, we're not talking about successful business, and we're not talking about mass appeal. We're not even talking about taste. We're talking about food and your aesthetic.

Currently, the roftlcopter who wants great sushi seems to be at war with the roftlcopter who likes OG lasagna.

Okay, so you like OG lasagna. That doesn't make you a criminal or a bad person or a hopeless prospect as a chef. It means you like something that's oversauced, oversweetened, over-gooey, and somewhat gluey. It is what it is, let's not make too big a dea out of it. I'm sure Escoffier would have liked Little Debbies. I know I do. On the other hand, that doesn't make the Swiss Rolls or the lasagna good, at least not in the sense that it's well prepared. It means we like something we know is bad.

The aesthetic of what makes food "good" can be difficult to elucidate because there are so many points of view, and none of them cover the topic completely. My aesthetic is a modern one, I learned from Alice Waters more than anyone else.

"Well prepared," and "I like it," are too different things. Good food, as I mean it, is well prepared.

Preparation requires thought. Food tells a story about itself. A good story has a relatively simple theme. The story is enhanced by the good quality ingredients, strong technique, and supportive food and beverage pairings. A good dish is always about something. A good meal builds to its strongest point, then finishes happily.

Sometimes the theme is a single thing -- steak is about meaty goodness. Doesn't matter what sauce you use, the sauce is merely an enhancement meant to develop the meat's taste and to keep the diner from growing bored. Still, steak is always about the meat.

A proper Caesar salad is about lemon. All of the components: egg, Worcestershire, tons of cheese, best olive oil, anchovies, garlic, croutons, romaine lettuce, etc., all those ingredients and textures are there to give the lemon balance and perspective so it can be lemony, but not too lemony. There are a lot of bad Caesar salads in this world -- most of them are a mess of creamy-parmesan-crouton-mildly garlicky diffuseness that's not about anything and has had anything with the slightest bit of integrity removed. Wouldn't want to offend.

Sometimes it's a combination of things. For instance, there are a number of Thai soups that are built around the combination of coconut and lemongrass. Take a Mexican mole which is built around a mix of dozens of spices -- it is what it is, that particular distinctive blend that makes mole amarillo or mole negro. They're not the same, they're not diffuse. On the contrary, they are each distinct and pointed.

It's better than going to a waffle house or taco bell or something.

Depends on the waffle house. IMO Taco Bell, OG and Appleby's have a lot in common. Indifferent food cooked to the lowest common denominator -- but lots of people like it. I happen to like Taco Bell's beans, and their plain bean burritos. Yet, where live, I have convenient access to some of the best Mexican street food, cuisine, and everything that falls between. It doesn't mean the beans are good, they're not. They're bland, creamy, underseasoned and go well with raw chopped onions. But then, it's about the onion.

You can like Mrs. Paul's fish sticks and great sushi, just bear in mind they're different things.

BDL

[RPMcMurphy]

i agree with Boar....it's kind of a "what the masses" like mentality that makes "us foodies" shy away.

For instance, my cafeteria at work (desk job at a fortune 100 company) is great. We have a (all made to order) grill station, sandwich station, salad bar, pizza station, dessert and soup station and then we have 1 station dedicated to a "gourmet"ish meal of the day, that changes daily. Yesterday was Gorgonzola encrusted pork loin with some sort of sweet potato and a choice of a few sides.....for 4.99.

the line is 20-30 deep for the grill station or the pizza station every day.....whereare the line for the "gourmet" station is EMPTY...and its not BAD food...its "well prepared" and good.

[roflcopter]

i guess i'd never looked at it from that point of view before...i never considered the difference between "well-prepared" and "i like it"...that's a good point that i had overlooked.

and it's funny, because it seems like i'm putting on the boxing gloves for OG lasagna, which i don't really even like that much in the first place...you're right, their pasta is always overcooked. and i realize this because i happen to like mildly undercooked pasta. lasagna was just the first example that came to mind, hahaha. i could've at least been sticking up for a good seafood dish or something.

my whole family is proof of this phenomenon...they complain when i cook pasta with a little bite left to it; they would rather have it mushy. so i could see why OG would overcook all their pasta. it's what people want. and what people want may not be the same as what is "well prepared".

reading posts like yours, BDL, make me realize that i still have a lot of learning to do. forgive me for my naivety.