Slow Food Attitude

Cape Chef asked me to move the conversation over here, so here's the new thread.

Phatch had a problem with the Slow Food movement - here's what he said:

Phil, I have been wrestling with this misconception a great deal, and trying to figure out its roots. Perhaps you can help me.

My dictionary says that elite means: "the choice or most carefully selected part of a group, as in a society of profession." (and also a kind of typewriter). Is there something wrong with a group of people who believe that the Delaware Bay Oyster, or Hand-Parched Wild Rice, or the Suncrest Peach (among hundreds of other foods) are items that are worth preserving? What about the way of life of the Uzbek goat herder or the Tibetan yak's milk cheese maker or a sumatran coffee grower? Is there something wrong with wanting these things to continue to exist? Because that's what Slow Food does.

The dictionary also says that (besides being a shoemaker) a snob is "a person who attaches great importance to wealth, social position, etc., having contempt for and keeping aloof from those whom he considers his inferiors, often one admiring, imitating, and seeking to associate with those whom he considers his superiors" ALSO "A person who regards himself as better than others in some (specified) way and behaves undemocratically."

Aside from its ability to feed and educate my children, I attach no great importance to wealth, and Slow Food as an organization doesn't have enough money to do so. As for the "contempt" and "aloof” parts of the definition, as well as the "admiring and imitating" parts, we certainly don't do that with regard to people. If we do it with regard to food (and we do), it is only because we see those foods as under threat of extinction from the onslaught of the industrialization and standardization of foods and flavor, and wish to protect them.

I see no snobbery whatsoever in protecting farmers and artisans and the food they produce. I see no snobbery at all in teaching elementary school children to taste foods consciously and conscientiously. I see no snobbery in drawing closer connections between a community and its local farmers. This is what Slow Food does.

If we throw some big, fancy-schmansy dinners along the way, what’s wrong with that? It’s what keeps most of the people on this forum (including me) gainfully employed.

Perhaps you meant, through insinuation or otherwise, that we are "intellectuals." If so, then to that I plead guilty on behalf of the movement, and myself, since I have never understood the negative connotations that some in our society have attached to that word. I for one would be proud to have the word applied to me, if it can be, because it means “of or done by the intellect; appealing to the intellect; requiring or using intelligence; having or showing a high degree of intelligence.” Slow Food sounds pretty smart to me.

You should thank the farmer who raised it, but I've no doubt you did that ;) . How 'bout your lucky stars? Maybe it's for another thread, but how'd you prepare it? (I smoked one and deep fried the other this past year)

Thanks for posting our international website there, CC. As long as we're mentioning the websites, get a load of these!

Slow Food USA
The Slow Food Foundation for Biodiversity
The University of Gastronomic Sciences
Terra Madre
Terra Madre Forum

Also, at The Slow Food Forum, there is a List of all the local convivium websites

OK, well, this is interesting. Allowing for the fact that, especially in this country, having an opinion about just about anything can & will be construed as political, I'd like to know how you see Slow Food as involved in politics.

The organization is non-partisan, has never backed any candidate for office, and has no politicians as members (that I know of, but there are 12,000 of us in the US and 80,000 worldwide, so, hard to be sure).

We almost never have politicians speak to us at our gatherings, in fact now it's even against our bylaws. Before it was, we did have a presidential candidate speak to our Natioanl Convention, but that's because he was the Governor of the state where we met.

Slow Food USA has never lobbied congress or spoken to a committee. Slow Food in Europe has done so for the EU, but only at the EU's invitation.

So yes, we have some very strong opinons which I alluded to in an earlier post, but we are not involved in politics except on the very lowest, grass-roots & personal levels.

On the Slow Food Forum, you will see posts suggesting that people should back this or that legislation (I even post some myself), but it is clearly never the official position of the movement, any more than my doing so here would imply that such was the position of CC and everybody who runs this marvelous forum.

Wow, really? Please quote the stuff that "convinced you."

And as for why you "opinions became the point when Glenn's were driving the other thread," it's just because you were more succinct. I'm interested in continuing this discussion with both of you. :bounce:

Sorry you feel that way, but in the original thread (http://www.cheftalkcafe.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=13095 ) where I got your quote, you didn't say anything about what the politics that bothered you were, save for agreeing with what Food Junkie said...

I think that was all pretty tongue-in-cheek, don't you?

Well, yeah, I guess, but isn't that a discussion? What are these forums for? I sure can't make you post, but I would like to understand your thoughts and opinions

Didn't think you had an "agenda." I'm merely trying to get a grasp of what you and others have found "elitist," "snobby," or "too political" about the movement.

Well, OK, don't then I guess. You are not the only person I was asking, I just used your comments to make a point. I would like for anyone/everyone to jump in on either side and help me understand the point of view you and others hold.

Can anyone out there repond to the points I made to start the thread?

Well, I've understood from the start that Slow Food is not to your liking or to Phil's. I understand you find it elitist and snobby. What I don't understand is the how's and why's of finding it elitist and snobby, and that's what I'm trying to figure out. Not to "convert" either of you, believe me, I'm not the prostheletizing type. I'm just trying to gain a handle on what makes the organization appear elitist & snobby to you.

See what I mean? You wouldn't want those labels attached to an organization you're affiliated with, would you? And if you believed them to be erroneous, then wouldn't you try to root out the causes of that false impression? That's all I'm trying to do.

Hmmmm.... OK. Well, anyone?

Clearly so. Is it - and I swear I don't mean this to be patronizing - is it just that we're right about some things? I mean, do people find it pretentious that we talk about the benefits and logic of a Slow Food approach?

Phil & Glenn "know (elitisim & snobbery) when they see it" but can't tell me what it is that they see.

Perhaps it's because I'm inside the Movement that I can't see it. But that's why I'm asking others.

OK, Pete, thank you. That helps.

So as with most problems, most misunderstandings between humans, it is a problem of communication breakdown. Some (only a few, says Pete) put across their beliefs in local, sustainable cuisine in such a way as to make it seem elitist. Have I got that right? It's as if their saying "MY way to live is FAR superior to YOUR way to live, so you're a lower form of life." Or at least, it's interpreted that way by the listener. Am I beginning to catch on?

What is it about seeking out the best in something and telling people about it that makes people seem snobby? It's especially so with food, wine, & anything artistic. If I were to say to you that the Hemi V8 is much better than the VorTec engine, you might agree or disagree with me, but you probably wouldn't think I was a car snob.

I guess it has to do with tone. Some can find it hard, and maybe I'm one of these, to communicate a good idea without having it come across that way. I'll keep working on it.

I honestly don't mind, don't care, if people want to eat at olive garden or grow 7000 acres BE Corn. What I and the rest of Slow Food believe is that there can be deterimental effects to these activities, so we're trying to stop those from happening.

Folks might enjoy the olive garden bread sticks, and have a virtual religious experience eating them, and that's great, good for them. But it's unfortunate that places like the olive garden wipe out little local cafe's the way wal-mart or menard's wipe out mom & pop hardware stores.

See? So it's not the proliferation of agribusiness and chain restaurants we object to, it's the detrimental effects they can have to the what is, in our opinion, the good stuff.

Am I being a snob?

OK, catchin' on now (guess I'm "slow" in more ways than one!)

What I have to do now is try to see the examples of this for myself. Being so deeply entrenched in the Movement, it's hard to see this stuff. Maybe because they are saying stuff I usually already agree with, I don't necessarily notice their tone.

I can sure understand people's frustration with that perception, though. As an omnivore, I often have that sort of problem with a very specific type of vegetarian, who thinks that I am responsible for all the ills in the world because I'll eat a baby cow if given the chance.

I shall work to root this "snobbery" thing out of the movement as best I can, but I shall have to learn to identify it first. Right now, all I can see is the reaction to it.

Amen, Shroom, well said.

Lately I have felt that it's of no use to try to convince people that we are not elitists or snobs. I think that folks who jump to such conclusions are gonna do so no matter what we say or do. We build gardens in schools (including right there in STL); we send support to victims of disasters like the Shepherd's Way Farm and the Indian ocean Tsunami; we built the worlds first University of Gastonomic Science and a worldwide network of sustainable family farms and artisans. Still all some folks see only the $100/plate dinners that finance the good work we do.

I'm starting to say "OK fine. I'm sorry you see it that way, I'd like to change your mind, but I have to get back work on changing the food system."