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Insight from Chef Kaiser

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 
To All,

Maybe some of you got offended by my being so direct the way I do write. But nobody can disagree with me, that America with it fast food principals to feed people cheap did anything good to the culinary world.

I understand the reactive chef of today, who get upset with me, but again we have to become more proactive as a chefs community to speak clearly the same language.

Here an answer to a post about the tortilla:

350 grams All purpose flour
2 grams Salt
280 grams Luck warm water

And just mix it all to a dough. In this recipe we don’t even talk about fat, well you can add if you want no problem it makes it more smooth and costs more.

Well the quick Asian version of today.

You can also use

Corn flour like the Mexican do but when applying the same recipe above the tortilla will be harder. Therefore just add some oil that will do the trick, just try any oil or animal fat to your likings. Well with the same principal what oil do I use for a traditional Vienna Applestrudel and be able to stretch that dough paper thin?

Regards

Chef Kaiser


post #2 of 18
I think there are plenty of people who can disagree with you, Kaiser. How about I name a few-Craig Claiborne, Julia Child, James Beard, Bill Neal, Alfred Portale, Danielle Custer, Mark Miller, Paul Prudhomme, John T. Edge, Alice Waters, Jeremiah Tower, Rick Bayless, Jenny Fitch, Ben and Karen Barker and many, many more.
Don't forget, America is the indigenous source of tomatoes, potatoes, chocolate, cinnamon, vanilla and many, many other ingredients that are taken for granted as essential ingredients in European cuisines. The Native Americans were using these in beautiful combinations 10,000 years before your ancestors even thought of chasing a goat around the Alps for food.

Just keep spewing your ignorance and see how many friends you make here in the states.

Sheesh!

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www.foodandphoto.com

Liquored up and laquered down,
She's got the biggest hair in town!

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post #3 of 18
You know I was going to reply to this, but I just give up. I don't like beating my head against a wall no matter how good it feels when I stop. Let me only say in the nicest way I can, you really need to take a step back and reread the things you write. We at Cheftalk do our best to respect everyones opinions even if we disagree. Because it's okay to disagree. In the years that I have been a part of this community I don't honestly recall anyone ever climbing on a box and shouting at the top of their lungs for the community at large to follow the shining example they are setting as I am seeing lately.

Just realize that we are all different and the love of food and cooking is what brings us together with all our faults and foibles. Remember this my friend, when in the Chefs house; Rule #1 the Chef is always right, rule #2 when in doubt refer to rule #1. This is not your house.

If you have an opinion, say so. It is after all your opinion and your right to state it. Just don't make the mistake that every utterance out of your mouth is gospel for us all to gather 'round and admire.

So lets talk the art of cooking and how we as individuals relate to it and create it.

Edit:
As I think about this it worries me. I don't want Chef Kaiser to feel that everything he posts is going to be attacked, that's not the case at all. In fact in another thread I agreed with him. It's only when comments are made that I or others feel attack directly or indirectly the integrity of our board members or countrypeople as a whole that I get defensive.
I have nothing against the Chef, but I also feel no compunction to hold my tongue to defend things that I don't agree with.
My latest musical venture!
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My latest musical venture!
http://myspace.com/nikandtheniceguys
 
Also
http://www.myspace.com/popshowband "I'm at the age when food has taken the place of sex in my life. In fact I've just had a mirror put over my kitchen table." Rodney Dangerfield RIP
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post #4 of 18
"i just believe there should be some rules here. As most chefs or hobby chefs hardly post any recipe. Are they all egocentric or dont know? God gave us as Chef very humble ingredients like the carrot and i know that for a fact the carrot in any place of the world has the same structure. Well maybe Chef should believe more in the gift of God. "
I believe in the gift of god. God has given me the gift to figure someone like Mr. Kaiser out. I don't think he is malacious. I am going to understand him as "Chef History on Tape" It's a fact that just about all of his posts can come from a laptop and some good culinary history program.
I have met many people who have to catagorize everything and everyone. Most of the times this is a result of not belonging to, or not having a caragory to fit into. No slam here, just trying to figure things out. Like I have said, I have spent time in Switzerland and have worked with quite a few Swiss and German Pastry Chefs. I CAN remember each and every one of them. I CAN'T remember one Swiss or German baker that I have worked with here in the states. I spent too much time trying to forget them.
FOR YEARS I LIVED TO WORK! NOW I WORK TO LIVE!
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FOR YEARS I LIVED TO WORK! NOW I WORK TO LIVE!
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post #5 of 18
what we all need to realize is that we all have different backgrounds and upbringings, it's what makes us different. i do believe that we all have the right to share our opinions and beliefs, but that nobody's is wrong or any better or worse than anybody elses.

this has turned into too much of a bashing of each other. we need to wipe the slate clean and start over new. let's just try to use our words very carefully in the future.
Life's too short to eat bad food and drink bad wine.
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Life's too short to eat bad food and drink bad wine.
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post #6 of 18
I agree lets move on to more constructive topics.
Thanks,

Nicko 
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Thanks,

Nicko 
ChefTalk.com Founder
All About Braising: The Art of Uncomplicated Cooking
All About Braising: The Art of Uncomplicated Cooking
Bacon (I made)
(26 photos)
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post #7 of 18
I concur :chef:
http://www.frappr.com/chefsunited
One time a guy pulled a knife on me. I could tell it wasn't a professional job; it had butter on it.- Rodney Dangerfield -


'We're ALL amateurs; It's just that some of us are more professional about it than others'. - George Carlin
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http://www.frappr.com/chefsunited
One time a guy pulled a knife on me. I could tell it wasn't a professional job; it had butter on it.- Rodney Dangerfield -


'We're ALL amateurs; It's just that some of us are more professional about it than others'. - George Carlin
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post #8 of 18
Fast food is relative.
We did not invent the hamburger, the frankfurter, the fish and chips shop, or the Indian take-away.

And i would happily pit the best chef's here against any in the world.

That being said, our fast food culture came about as a result of our country being the per capita most productive in the world. We became crushed for time, and are moreso today than ever. Corperate America simply found a need and filled it.

Then the advertising pro's jumped in and created need where there was none. More insidious than fast food are the chains, inflicting culinary sameness on the population.


But, there is still great food, in abundance, crafted with care, love, and tradition, in nearly every city and town in America. The "fast food culture" you speak of is being inflicted on the rest of the world by corperations, not Americans, and the average investor in those corperations is a likely to be a frenchman, a japanese, or german, or a foreign corperation, as an American citizen.
post #9 of 18
I am staying out of this one. But I would like to say one thing. Chef K with all due respect, I would not be to quick to judge American Chefs sir. I concur with everyone else on this one.

Regards Cakerookie
post #10 of 18
Thread Starter 
Hi,

read my farewell note (under vegetable cuts), what I believe is happening in the US, and how positive I am that it is happening, that TV chef educate the general public about healthier eating today.

I am all honest, I see how people are getting sick and sicker in this world, and therefore chefs have a great responsibility and not depending on the industry.

I do see sick people everyday in an under developed country. The more please understand what I am trying to say about the industries, selling them chunck food.

What I am saying is not to offend the American Chef, well there fore all read more carefully what I am saying. But if an old chef to discover that I am only 44, well I speak back and say, I was not sleeping after my apprentice program as many chef did and still do.

I do respect the world chefs and it organization and we are not country chefs, with wrong prides.

Well it would just to be nice, if we only could all have the same language as Chef and not what is happening on this site, because French is Alien to most!

Well a dream I suppose!

Regards

HS
post #11 of 18
lest we forget the origin of the word "restaurant"
post #12 of 18
I generally don't agree with Chef K's viewpoint on a great many things... he seems to be too absolute about things. However, that being said, I think I understand what Chef K is getting at, and to a degree I see his point and <gasp> even agree with him. Let me explain...

There is a noticeable difference in lifestyle and work ethic from the current generation to that of the last one (Gen X)...

What I mean by that is that there are so many fields now where kids today can take "shortcut" programs to jump in... (in the IT field in which I currently work, there were "boot camps" for technical certifications that didn't teach the kids ANYTHING about technology rather than just taught them what answers to memorize for the certification test.)

The current generation is lazier than the last and believes that you can take shortcuts to success.

I believe that this is what Chef Kaiser is suggesting, and while I might disagree that this trend only applies to America, I do believe it is a generational thing. We have raised our children on the principals of instant gratification... (Look at how many people are in debt today because they refuse to take time to save up for what they want/need... even the banking system here facilitates instant gratification... you can get a home loan around here with no job and without having to prove income... (20 years ago you had to go out of your way to prove to the bank that you were trustworthy enough for a loan)

The other thing is that in America I believe that the culinary field in general is underappreciated and under valued... why? because of things like fast food, chain restaurants, etc... The average person has NO IDEA what "Culinary Arts" means.

(For example, I have been doing some reading on sanitation and food safety principals, and to be honest... I am SHOCKED that entire civilizations aren't wiped out because of some of the horrible things I have read about bacterias etc...)

All these TV chef's that dazzle your eyes and taste buds with their witty technique don't tell you what can happen behind the scenes... you don't see them scrubbing their countertops, scrubbing their utensils and knives, and you don't see them telling you exactly what can happen if you don't cook that piece of chicken the right way. In other words, the people who like to "learn" from these TV chefs are only getting a SMALL piece of what it means to really cook.

I look at the culture today and I find myself disappointed. And if I had to sum up everything that is wrong with the society I live in, I would sum it up as "There is too much instant gratification"

Anyway, that is my .02, if I read Chef K right then this is what he may be trying to say... (sometimes language barriers combined with "email" make it hard to get ones point across)
post #13 of 18
oh i see. The real issue is short cuts rather than "paying your dues". Let me gently expound my wisdom.

Yes, there are is always going to be the short cut crew. This is actually a blessing for those who are classically trained. The ones that actually hold the knowledge are at advantage to those who are not, in the way that they can guide to reach the objectives that are required.

This means that if you know then you can lead, if you lead then you can ask for the big money. Why are you worried - the fast track people will not know what you know, and that is your competitive advantage over them.

What you are worried about refers more to future responsibility and less to the here and now.

Another thing, is that i cannot judge american chefs - i have not worked with one, so i cannot say.

A third point is: how understaffed are you? magnify that in an global perspective and you will begin to understand what i am getting at - 2.5 months without a day off, and it is my job to cover gaps in man power

But i digress, as many people do, and say this:

I understand that you do not wish to insult americans, and that you have your own views and vision in regards to commercial cookery,

However, the ford like mass production and fast food chains are but a small part of the american culinary history, there are a great many institutions that have contributed to US culinary tradition. Perhaps it is a matter of better research, rather than some preconceived idea of an market place.

I am not to say that what you have said is wrong, more along the lines that you should look into it a little more.
"Nothing quite like the feeling of something newl"
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"Nothing quite like the feeling of something newl"
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post #14 of 18
Nick,
There are no problems here. In fact I am one of the ones who paid their dues.
Mr. Kaisers views are great in a perfect culinary world. I don't want to use the word resentment, I just can't think this early in the morning. I sometimes feel the same way about the American Culinary Arts profession. It does not exsist. It is wide open to all that want to prepare food for profit. The dues are different.My take on Chef Kaiser, is to stay way away for his view will never change and he has spent a long time learning about food history. The problem with food history and classical here in the states, it's like trying to put a square into a circle. His career is at the top for his understandfing food. Most sucessful carrers here are based on bottom line. It is so important here that many overlook the history. You can't compare the two careers. They are both great. We treat careers like the medical profession, we have chefs who focus on Mexican cooking that know more about the culoture and food then all others including classical. Many European have also followed the nouvell path. I will undedrstand where Kaiser is coming from for I have whitnessed it first hand. I will never try to change him just as he won'[t change me. You won't know if I'm sucessful till you walk in my shoes and the same holds true for him.
It like the fast food thing, I'm staying out for the USA is too young to put anything like this on them. Fast food goes back centuries. Roadside fast food has been in every culture.. It's not that healthy but it's fast. The americans put it in a building to increase bottom line.
The only part thatr concerns me is the respect issue. You must respect, not me but what I do, to gain respect back.
FOR YEARS I LIVED TO WORK! NOW I WORK TO LIVE!
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FOR YEARS I LIVED TO WORK! NOW I WORK TO LIVE!
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post #15 of 18
It amazes me how ignorant people can be. I pitty you chef k. You will spend time abroad and study the food but will never truely connect with the people. OPEN YOUR EYES!!!!!!!!!!
post #16 of 18
I wish I could cook what I want in my restaurant..........but the truth is I have to cook what will sell, what the public will buy.

And there is an age/culture differance I see everyday. We are primarly a steak house and we offer a twice baked potato with the steak dinner. Under age 30, they ask what they are, they order fries. Over 30, they love them, they remember them. I also don't see a lively conversation and interaction at young tables; they are used to having a TV or a movie to look at as part of their social time, they don't practice the art of conversaton.

People tend to eat how they are brought up, what's familiar.
post #17 of 18
i completely agree ith that. now, i'm one of those 'young' people you speak of, but i wasn't allowed to watch t.v. or movies all the time ( i was grounded most of the time :rolleyes: ), but a lot of my friends were allowed to watch as much t.v. as they wanted. and talking to them is like reading the t.v. guide. all they talk about is whats coming on t.v., or what movie is out. most of my generation (i'm 19, to give you a reference) doesn't value good food or how to enjoy it. at the restaurant i work at, we'll have young couples come in and order a 3 course dinner, and be in and out in 30-45 minutes. to them, food is food, and certainly not worth paying a lot of money for. the don't understand the atmosphere of the dining room, or the work that went into making the food great.
and on a distantly related subject, i've always found it interesting that people who eat in a nice restaurant think that the chef prepares every meal ("compliments to the chef", to which i reply "tell them the 19 year old culinary student says 'thank you!'")
Life's too short to eat bad food and drink bad wine.
www.marcomacon.com
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Life's too short to eat bad food and drink bad wine.
www.marcomacon.com
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post #18 of 18

Mezzopotamia...Romans...

The original "fast food". Do your homework. Mezzopotamia had "fast food" carts. Romans had pizzarias.

My FOURTEEN YEAR OLD DAUGHTER told me about this.

Don't use this issue to bash.

April
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