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Using correct terminology - Page 2

post #31 of 47
I agree. And, for what it's worth, Thomas Keller calls everybody in his kitchen either by their first name, or he addresses them as "chef." It's a gesture of res[pect. Think he might know something we don't?

I don't even want to get started on the "Martini" thing (to me a martini is gin and vermouth in a 5:1 ratio, well chilled, neat, with three pimiento-stuffed olives. Anything else is something else.) but I think it's an outgrowth of the grocery-list menus, where everything you've got in dry storage and in the coolers is listed, along with a brief description of how it's prepared, who developed it, where the guy cooking it came from, and a picture of his smokin' hot little sister.

Pffft. Some days it's not even worth dislocating my shoulders to get out of the straitjacket.
post #32 of 47
god what gall... thanks for clearing up the sauce gravy thing lol...

my exec would brag about the diff between beurnaise and hollandaise

and even i dont call myself a chef, i say im a line cook if im talking to someone who would understand the difference or a chef in training to idiots...
post #33 of 47
You should probably change your "Culinary Experience" thing to line cook then.;)
Anulos qui animum ostendunt omnes gestemus!
Anulos qui animum ostendunt omnes gestemus!
post #34 of 47
This I disagree with. Just because something is listed in an online dictionary...doesn't lead it to be true. I've looked up that several words that were partially or completely misdefined. A chef is the boss, and while the guy at the waffle house in our technical definition of the word can be considered a chef, I don't beleive him to be. Chefs realistically do little or no cooking unless it's a pretty small place. The guy flipping the pancakes most likely is only in charge of the pancakes as said above. Also, if it's a chain restaurant...what menu planning is involved? The corporate chef and/or headquarters makes the menu for him. All he has to do is order enough produce and everything to keep executing that menu every day and night.
post #35 of 47
Fools, allya! Gravy is another mother sauce. There are two kinds, white and brown. From their you derive all your smaller gravies.

What?? Do I have to teach you people everything?!?!??
post #36 of 47
Unless you are Mredikop and then gravy is the ONLY sauce- suitable for use on EVERYTHING! LOL
Bon Vive' !
Bon Vive' !
post #37 of 47
Bon Vive' !
Bon Vive' !
post #38 of 47
Had to laugh at bluechef's difference between a sauce and a gravy. When someone brags they went to culinary school and now they're a chef, that's what I ask them. If they don't know, I just nod and walk away. There is a difference and that's my litmus test for how much they actually know. My own pet peeve for misuse of terminology (especially by people who should know better) is celery stalk. I hate when I'm reading a recipe (and it can be for a substantial amount of something) that calls for 6 stalks of celery. Are they sure? Or do they mean ribs? I don't mind it so much if it's for something your Aunt Betty gave me the reciped for, but when it's in a culinary publication or commercial recipe, I just want to tear my hair out. That's my rant.
post #39 of 47
i dont get the celery stalk thing... Unless you would say 500 grams of celery?
post #40 of 47
I think he means that one thingy of celery is a "rib", not a "stalk."

Reminds me of trying to cook with my Icelandic (read: metric) wife... "Pass me 1/2 a cup of.... no, a cup is THAT cup, not just whatever cup is in the dishwasher. I don't know how many liters it is, dammit." :crazy:
post #41 of 47
Ok just so I know:

when I was in charge of the pastry dept at a country club (did all the planning, ordering, time management, even food cost) I was a pastry chef? :chef:

But now where I work I dont do much ordering or food cost so Im not a pastry chef any more? :suprise:

But soon I plan on leaving to go out on my then I will have to do all those things, so I will be a chef again? :chef: Except, Ill be working by myself mostly so....hmmmm.... I dunno. Please let me know. I dont want to offend anyone. lol :p

oh no! If I'm not a chef will I still be allowed to post on this forum?

post #42 of 47

A different point of view...

While I think many of the posts are spot on, there are others that seem a bit overboard to me. Same as the grammar police that I get emails from every day so I'm a bit sensitive to it :)

Using 'over the top' language to try and impress on your menu? Fine, I don't like it either. But I do usually consider it an attempt to impress rather than explicitly mislead. I've just never liked the snobbery of it all.

Ignorance in the kitchen by someone who should know better? Fine, educate them or be rightly annoyed.

But, there is another category that I have no issue with. And that's those examples of items like the 'carpaccio', or the 'confit', etc. While it's true that words start with very explicit meanings, it's also true that when they become common enough in the lexicon that they can be used to describe the 'style of' a dish, or even a 'method'. Particularly in inventive kitchens.

I don't think it's necessary for the chef to go into detail on a menu that he/she knows that the see-through slice of beet served with a little olive oil and salt isn't strictly carpaccio, nor do I think the customer is going to surprised when the dish arrives. Both parties are clear on why it's being used in the way it is, and that's because it helps to clarify in the consumers mind what they are ordering. It's a descriptive 'representation' of a dish on the menu, and the menu is not a dictionary. Are you going to really say that Ferran Adria should be taken to task because of his apple 'caviar'? Methinks thou doest protest too much.
post #43 of 47
I see what you are saying. It's like when I ask for a kleenex and someone says: "you know, its not technically a 'kleenex', its a tissue" Im like: get over it, you know what I mean.

However, I once ordered a fruit napolean (years ago) and I got some fresh fruit stacked with some slightly sweetened cracker type things. I was VERY disappointed. I felt like I had been misled. I mean it was nothing more than a fruit salad without any dressing. It certainly wasn't a dessert.

post #44 of 47
I hate naming shtuff......when you create dishes sometimes names relagated to something specific don't fit then you're scratching your head going, ok how many Julie's surprises are there going to be on the menu.......ugh, it is what it is, so most of the time the ingrediants are listed and no esoteric nor technical name is given.

What do you guys do?

Funny we were talking about calling sodas, Coke.....when it's some other brand, guess that's when you know you're a household name.
cooking with all your senses.....
cooking with all your senses.....
post #45 of 47
how about the term "chef" how come every cook is "a chef" you are either "the chef" or you are a cook and whats wrong with being a cook is it too lowly so when you are b*tching about terms remember we are in the world of image over substace. P.S is it a whip or a whisk I keep My whip in the bedroom where it belongs:crazy:
post #46 of 47
Hear, hear! You said it! I'm sorry, but there was a guy running around my area calling himself a chef (he got fired from a chain restaurant for burning toast). I finally had enough of him and asked what the difference between a sauce and a gravy was. He didn't know, so I told him until he did know at least that much, he had no business calling himself a chef. That would be like me referring to myself as a medical doctor because I can apply a band aid.
post #47 of 47

let's chill

You guys all need to lighten up a bit. Language, especially in our transitory culture, is ever evolving. I would argue it's even encouraged to mutate. I think most customers find pleasure in the changing vocabulary. I'm not a big fan of the overly wordy menus of young chefs, but with experience and confidence usually comes restraint. What we need to focus on is the "Deliciousness Factor" resulting from thoughtful cooking of the freshest ingredients. That is what impresses the customers most!
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