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Stock / Stew - Page 2

post #31 of 42
9/28/08 at 9:27pm
The sense of humor and smell of av gas came through pretty clearly. Perhaps a "Y" chromosome is required to appreciate the joke. :lol:

BDL
What were we talking about?
 
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post #32 of 42
9/28/08 at 10:26pm
Don't put a sports car in the oven. Not even a scooter. Sheet metal can do lots of things, but only if done properly.
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post #33 of 42
9/29/08 at 4:28am
Dont know if you can still get, but I have not seen in a long time. Seems like today what I see is a lot of chicken stock coming out of a jar or a can or a box, with a few small chickens in the pot. I think they call it progress???
CHEFED
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post #34 of 42
9/29/08 at 4:36am
........they call it progress??? Progesso?
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post #35 of 42
9/29/08 at 5:00am
Ain't that the truth. Still, there is a place for convenience, however, quality, imo, suffers too much for convenience these days. In my area, it's easy to find the quality of birds needed to make good stock or broth, but the supermarket's generally not the place to go. There are one or two growers that raise reasonably good stock-worthy birds, but only the smaller, more upscale supermarkets carry them. The Safeway-type stores carry cr#p.

However, there are several very good poultry sellers in the area, and they can provide almost any kind and size bird you want, including birds with feet, necks, and heads. And there are plenty of Asian markets, Hispanic markets, and even Halal and Kosher markets where the choices are greater and better than the regular supermarkets. Surely places like that exist outside of the San Francisco area?
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post #36 of 42
9/29/08 at 6:59am
:cool: Florida is strange, it is the only place I have ever seen Frozen Bologna, Salami , Ham , frankfurters, sausage come in from a purveyor.
All Kosher birds here are Empire brand frozen, imported from Brooklyn.It is so hot here at different times of year I think they are afraid of not freezing everything.
One time I was working in a real high end country club down here. I had to make a White Pistou with Truffles. I had to have them flown in from N..Y.to Miami airport and picked up there..... A lot different then when I was in N.Y. :cool:
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post #37 of 42
9/29/08 at 12:48pm
If your oriental supermarkets are like mine, they 'll sell you old birds. Head and feet on. They make fabulous stock.(long slow cooking) Alternatively i freeze carcasses when we're done with them after dinner and when i have 4 or 5 i use them.

At work we buy whole chickens, take what we need and stock the carcasses.

I have no problem bringing to the boil before simmering. We're not looking for consomme, we're after flavour and you skim the scum off anyway.

If i was making a casserole from scratch i would certainly use a free range, locally sourced bird. Anything else is truly a waste of time and desperately needs the addition of a stock cube.
"If we're not supposed to eat animals, why are they made of meat?" Jo Brand
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post #38 of 42
9/29/08 at 9:10pm
The Turkish bay leaves are in many an opinion more fragrant. On older bird will give you a more full bodied stock, and yess you will have to go at least 4 hours at the simmer- a rolling boil will churn the albumen you want to scum off the top back into your stock and muddy it up.

Some things you just don't want to take a short cut on and it's also something you can walk away from and not have to monitor constantly.

As far as pulling out legs and crisping you can- but just broil the legs- by the time they are done in the broth and ready for eating you really will not have extracted much- but no harm done if you want to give it a go this way. :chef:
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post #39 of 42
9/29/08 at 11:34pm
I don't know about that. There seem to be a handful of tough, old birds posting on the ChefTalk forums, for example.

mjb.
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post #40 of 42
9/30/08 at 2:41am

Bay Leaves

Hmmm .... I "sort of" find that to be the case. The California Bay Laurel leaves I get are very fresh - the trees grow all around here and it's easy to just pluck a few leaves. They are very intensely flavored, to the point of almost being too intense and oily. Even the leaves purchased in the markets have that intensity .

Now the Turkish leaves are generally nowhere near as fresh - even the fresh ones are a little older than the local Bay Laurel leaves - and lack that intense aroma and flavor. But, imo, their flavor, while milder, is more rounded and deeper, and the leaves lend themselves better to cooking.

I've recently found a source for fresher Turkish leaves, and am excited about trying them. I've not yet purchased them. They are supposed to be "almost like picking them from the tree."

There's an anecdote that I came across that is worth mentioning:
"San Francisco chef Judy Rodgers recalls as a young cook
thinking, 'If one bay leaf is good, more are better.' She
doesn't remember how many she put in a duck braise, just
that 'When I pulled that puppy out of the oven at quarter to
6, it was terrible. You could not eat it. It was like biting into
an Excedrin.'

So for a bouquet garni for a braise or stew, as a rule,
Rodgers warns, one bay leaf will do."
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post #41 of 42
10/1/08 at 3:51pm
Kudos.

I honestly have not compared them side by side- I had a bay tree living in CA and used it extensively, I have also used the dried Turkish. Many are of the opinion that the Turkish has a better flavor, and that's what I mentioned.

I found the results of the dishes or stocks using either to be fine. If I purposely did two exact dishes side by side with the two different types
it would be interesting to see the subleties. Again, the amount that one is using is usually very small. What have you found to be the case?

Many recipes will specifically state NOT CALIFORNIA BAY LEAVES.
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post #42 of 42
10/1/08 at 4:51pm
I much prefer the deeper, more flavorful and subtle taste of the Turkish leaves, but it is important to get good ones. There are some sources that sell old and overly dry leaves, and they are pretty much worthless except, perhaps, as decorations. No value for cooking.

Whenever I write a recipe I specify which leaves to use. Invariably it's the Turkish leaf that finds its way into my dishes.
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