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Opinions on Chroma/Porsche knives

post #1 of 41
Thread Starter 
Anyone out there have an opinion on the Chroma/ F. A. Porsche knives? I've been looking at them at one of the local shops and the people there said they're pretty good, but I'm leery of salespeople in general, so I figured I'd ask around. Only one guy in my kitchen has heard of them, and he's never used them. Have any of you, who have actually used them, care to voice an opinion?
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post #2 of 41
I've only seen them. They're pretty but the handles scare me.
post #3 of 41
Very sexy design. Decent blade steel, and a decent, not too Germanic profile on the chef's knife. Miserable handle. Slippery and uncomfortable for most hands and most grip types -- including mine (big hands, very forgiving, soft, pinch-grip). For some reason they like them in the UK and Oz. Go figure.

Bottom line: Don't buy unless you have a lot of expensive appliances in your kitchen and eat out 20+ times a week.

BDL

PS. Before investing a lot of money in spiffy, new knives please have a plan on how you're going to keep them sharp. All knives get dull, no matter how expensive, nor how sharp they came out of the box. And all dull knives are equal.
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post #4 of 41
Thread Starter 
That's kinda what I was thinking. That handle looks as if it could be terrible, or a godsend, but probably the former of the two. I haven't actualy held one yet, but as I have big hands and a soft pinch-grip as well, I don't think I will be anytime soon.

Back to my carbon Sabatier I go. I just get distracted by shiny things...
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post #5 of 41
Handle is very comfortable. Not in a closed grip gonna use for 3 hours of intricate work kinda way. More in a I just grabbed this to prep a steak because I've spent enough time proving my prowess with Sabatiers. If you're going to be using the knife at any angle but normal to the horizon (up and down), this is not really appropriate.

Steel is a great compromise between hard, brittle japanese and soft, durable western knives.

Plus you can let it go through the dishwasher, edge up, top rack. This is invaluable at home, once you get used to doing it again.

Bottom line: I use my carbon 4star elephant sabatier when I want to feel good about knowing my way around a blade. But I most often grab the Chroma. I can't recommend it highly enough. Balanced as all ****, too.
post #6 of 41
Change that to eating out 20 times a month at it describes a lot of people I know to a T. :lol:
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post #7 of 41
I find the looks off putting and they don't look like they'd be comfortable to use for any great length of time. But the Chroma Haiku series looks pretty sexy.
"Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but we rather have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit." - Aristotle
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"Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but we rather have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit." - Aristotle
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post #8 of 41
I had to order something from Lee Valley today and I stumbled upon a set of knives , well lets just say I fell off my chair when I saw them............


THEY ARE BEAUTIFUL..........(can you hear my heart, thump , thump )


http://www.chefdepot.net/porsche.htm


I did not see this thread until I searched ...only to find a thread just recently (how did I miss this ?)


The thing that worries me is the handle.


Then I saw another set called “Maitre de Cuisine” , beautiful too...
In the magazine I saw a set that looks like some of my Sabatier knives, which brings me to my question , how do I know that my knives are authentic. What is the trademark of these knives (Sabatier) ?
Sorry if this sounds like a dumb question, everything seems to be made in China.....

Petals
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post #9 of 41
A good thing to be worried about. For awhile at least, it seemed as if a lot of the professional community in the UK, Australia and NZ liked these knives; then they stopped talking about them completely. Bring up the subject and all you hear is ... [crickets]. It seems as if long-term handle comfort didn't work out. You can say pretty much the same thing about Globals as well -- from the geography of their popularity on down.

In your particular case, you put too much reliance on your knives to just go out and buy a bunch. On the other hand, if you can afford to buy and try one for long enough to get a sense of whether it suits you or not -- the worst that can happen is that you don't like it, try and sell it, and no one's interested because it's an idea whose time has time has passed.

Honestly, I wouldn't. But you're you.

Worth its own thread, I'll start it for you.

BDL
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post #10 of 41
I have a Global gyuto and pairing knife. The handles are really not bad. Having said that I'd be more than happy to sell them. :lol:
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post #11 of 41
Just like with Global - another brand that relies on style over substance - Porsche knives seem to be used mostly by people who do not cook, or use them to slice bread in the morning, and nothing else.

The handles - just like Global - are abysmal if you use them for more than a very short period of time. They are slippery and have a weird angle that doesn't seem to make any sense, ergonomically.
post #12 of 41

FYI:
laser.gif
"Be aware of counterfeit [T]ype 301 block sets
Good things are always copied. Especially our CHROMA [T]ype 301 blocks. Be aware of the fakes, they are easy to spot. On the box it just says "PORSCHE" and it also contains a pair of cheap scissors. On the real product you can always read "Design by F.A. Porsche[!]" These block sets can be found on the internet. November 2006"


Edited by TheUnknownCook - 12/16/10 at 11:15am
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Buttercup: You mock my pain!
Man in Black: Life is pain, Highness! Anyone who says differently is selling something. -- The Princess Bride
Miracle Max: Sonny, true love is the greatest thing, in the world-except for a nice MLT - mutton, lettuce and tomato sandwich, where the mutton is nice and lean...
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post #13 of 41
Jeez. Those look weird. They look like a straight razor minus its scales. Those handles look downright uncomfortable.




I agree 110%. Almost every global knife I have ever held has the most unusual angles to its handle. It just downright hurts.

There is however one exception: The G-2 chef`s knife. I don`t like the way it looks, its edge retention is not anything special. It is however, one of my favourite knives to use. No matter what I`m doing, I feel like the knife is just another finger, and it does whatever I want. I don`t find the handle awkward, somehow it just works. I`ve used my g-2 everyday for almost all my mise before and never felt that the handle was killing my hand. (Big hands, hard pinch grip, FWIW)

Now if only it didn`t look so trashy.
post #14 of 41
I have used these Chroma 301 for several years now. I LOVE THEM. They fit my hand perfectly and always am having the other cooks want to use them as well. I have (had) problems with carpal tunnel but with these, none... the edge stays nice, I use a whetstone and the blade comes back quick. I take them with me when I travel and while the handle may be scary looking, it is great and when someone picks them up - they feel it immediately. Not like your holding a broom stick. Never have had one slip or feel uncomfortable. Like that they are Japanese style vs. western blade. Sharper I think. I do not suggest you put in the dishwasher...
post #15 of 41

It was just today that I held a porche in my hand and I must say that as beautiful as it looked (and I love something that looks really good) it was a big dissapointment for me.

The handle had different angles that when I held it in my hand I did not know how to grasp the handle , not wanting to feel those lines. All those lined edges....what for ?

The second thing I did not like about the knife was the guard or rivet that separates the handle from the blade, I am not sure if you understand my point but my hand kept touching it. Why is it there ?  The owner of the store kept trying to persuade me to buy it as the new "concept of knives"......Okkkkkkk

For so long I thought I was missing out on this knife but after today, I don't feel bad about not owning it. For those who enjoy the knife, I am glad you do, don't get me wrong. But its just not meant for me.

 

 

 

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post #16 of 41

Chef Petals,

 

Great looking but horrible ergonomics.  Chroma says your hand should automatically fall into the proper postion, but that doesn't seem to happen for many -- if any.  I know very few people who can tolerate them for long, especially pros who, for some reason, want to use a knife like a knife.  The quality of the blades is surprisingly bad for a Japanese made knife.

 

All in all, a great knife not to buy.  You done good.

 

All of your posts are at least very good.  The way you expressed your perplexity about the way the handle actually felt as opposed to "good," or "right" made this one was great.  Pre-purchase trips to the store to pretend to try a knife are overrated, except in the case of radical "ergonomic" handles.  Your experience shows why.

 

FYI:  According to Chroma, the purpose of the buttons is to let you know where the handle ends and the blade begins.  It's meant primarly as a cue for people who, like you, use a pinch grip at least on some knives most or time, as a cue to help locate the "pinch."

 

Bored with our current knives are we?  You're not alone. 

 

BDL


Edited by boar_d_laze - 8/22/10 at 9:42am
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post #17 of 41

Pardon the double post, but for the benefit of anyone interested in what the hubbub is all about...

 

They are beautiful indeed.

 

301_a500.jpg

 

If you're interested in Chroma's propaganda, you may find it here: http://www.chroma-cutlery.com/type301.php

 

BDL

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post #18 of 41

Sorry BDL you do not like them, I have the set and I like them a lot. I do use the pinch grip and they suit me just fine.

The edge is easy to sharpen and maintain-however you cannot use a steel on them. A fine stone is preferred.

I do not find the handle getting slippery at all, I find it comfortable as well. Maybe I hold a knife differently? I Dunno.

I do not put much stock in the posts of culinary students, the people who eat out 20x a month statement well...that is kind of ignorant , most students would not know the differences in knives. A plastic picnic knife would impress some if it had a fancy Japanese name and Rachel Ray endorsed it.

 

Plenty of Chroma haters here most with little or no experience with the knife. BDL-- chroma propoganda?? Thats funny.

 

Funy too,  in all these posts only 3-4 people have actually tried or used one. The reviews were a mixed bag love/hate.

Best off to try them yourself and not rely on peoples opinions.

 

Me myself, I hate German knives, the huge tangs and the imposibly thick blades-some love them but not me.

Great for heavy chopping and if you are going to unleash a blitzkreig on a rack of lamb.

 

Japanese eingle ground blades seem more for the dillentant who are keener to impress their fellow cooks then anything.

Sure they have a purpose and lovers, but I feel they are like white guys who study to become ninjas. Unless of course you are a serious sushi chef, I am ambidexterous so the edge on one side bothers me as I can use either hand to cut with.

 

I am a big lover of very thin hollw grind blades, I use the pinch grip and use a stone to sharpen all my knives, hate steels.

Big tangs on the bottom of the blade always result in the knife having a belly after repeated sharpenings, thats why I do not use them.

 

The chroma fits all these requirements and preferences for me just fine. Try one out for yourself.

 

Hope I stirred up the hornets nest here LOL.

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post #19 of 41

Rat,

 

I am glad you enjoy them. I just wished they felt more comfortable in my hand. I had been looking at them for awhile (6 months) but yesterday after spending an hour in the store I just could not get past the points I posted above.

Maybe I am getting too old ? Maybe I am set in my ways ? But when it comes down to it, if I have to put good money out on knives it must be something I will feel comfortable with. I have my Sabs.......the new and the old, and even with the new style...well they both serve a purpose. My Mac knives are gems too.

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post #20 of 41

Petals, thats fine. I am not slamming you or trying to persuade you either way.

I just get aggrivated as many people post things based on little or no experience. Everything is subject to personal preference.

For something as personal as knives, the mainstay worktool. I think they are like shoes, they fit everyone differently.

That is why I strongly encourage people to try things themselves and SEE for themselves. I'm glad you actually tried them out before deciding against them.

You can go to the post about chef clogs and substitute Porsche Chroma knife for chef clog and the posts would read the same.

Good luck!! I like your  Sab on the right, I bet it could tell some stories.

Regards, Rat.

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post #21 of 41

Rat,

 

I really like your post.  You were very specific about the Porsche Chromas -- let's talk about them a little more.  You wrote:

I have the set and I like them a lot. I do use the pinch grip and they suit me just fine.

 

It's good that you like them.  I love that you like them. 

 

The edge is easy to sharpen and maintain...

 

What makes the edge particularly easy to sharpen, in your opinion?  And easy to sharpen compared to what?  Are they easier to sharpen than, say, one of my carbon Sabatiers? 

 

...however you cannot use a steel on them. A fine stone is preferred.

 

That's what Chroma says on its site, but... Why can't you use a steel on them?  There's simply no reason not to.  The alloy isn't that hard, the angles aren't acute, the geometry isn't asymmetric.  Of course, most people use bad steels and use them poorly.  But that's something else. 

 

What do you mean by fine stone?  And why just a fine stone?  Most sharpeners like to use at least two stones.  I prefer four. 

 

Also, How can a knife which "cannot" be trued on a steel be easier to maintain than one which can?

 

I do not find the handle getting slippery at all, I find it comfortable as well. Maybe I hold a knife differently? I Dunno.

 

A lot of thought and testing went into those handles.  Some people are bound to like them.  Your hand type must be the right type.  Good for them, and good for you.  I have an extremely tolerant grip, but could never get comfortable with them.


Plenty of Chroma haters here most with little or no experience with the knife. BDL-- chroma propoganda?? Thats funny.  Funy too,  in all these posts only 3-4 people have actually tried or used one. The reviews were a mixed bag love/hate.  Best off to try them yourself and not rely on peoples opinions.

 

"Propaganda" in the sense that they're trying to sell you a knife, not provide a comprehensive report.  No criticism intended.   

 

Unfortunately very few people have the opportunity to actually try a knife -- as opposed to waving it around in a store.  Worse, that experience can be very misleading.  When I taught cooking and knife skills classes I had the chance to try a lot of knives, Chromas among them.  

 

Me myself, I hate German knives, the huge tangs and the imposibly thick blades-some love them but not me.  Great for heavy chopping and if you are going to unleash a blitzkreig on a rack of lamb.

 

With you there, although "hate" is too strong a word.  I prefer light knives over heavy and French to German profile chef's knives.

 

Japanese eingle ground blades seem more for the dillentant who are keener to impress their fellow cooks then anything.  Sure they have a purpose and lovers, but I feel they are like white guys who study to become ninjas. Unless of course you are a serious sushi chef, I am ambidexterous so the edge on one side bothers me as I can use either hand to cut with.

 

Why bring the subject of traditional Japanese knives up aAs you say chisel edged knives have particular purposes which don't come up that often in western kitchens.  A lot of people buy knives as hobbyist or collector's items and/or toys -- just to have fun with.  Why shouldn't they?  Good for them. 

 

I am a big lover of very thin hollw grind blades, I use the pinch grip and use a stone to sharpen all my knives, hate steels.

 

Chromas are not "very thin," nor even thin at all.  As Japanese knives go, they are portly.  They're even thicker than some of the thinner European knives, Forschners by eay of example.    

 

There are a lot of ways to define "hollow ground."  I'm not sure what you mean. What makes you like "hollow ground" more than flat bevel, double-bevel, multi-bevel or convex grinds?

 

Pinch grip -- check.

 

Stone, but no steel -- Returning to the topic:  Some knives shouldn't be steeled, but as long as the edge isn't more assymetric than 66/33; the angle no more acute than 10*, or the steel no harder than about 63RCH, proper use of an appropriate rod hone is the most efficient way to true an edge.  If you don't demand a lot of polish, it can also refresh an edge.

 

In fact, Porsche Chromas are actually rather "soft" as Japanese knives go -- especially in their price range.  Chroma rates them at 56-58RCH, but as manufacturers are notorious for optimistic hardness ratings, >56 is probably about right.  That's not only no better than a Messermeister, but enough less than such entry level Japanese made western style knives as Misono Moly to make a difference. 

 

Big tangs on the bottom of the blade always result in the knife having a belly after repeated sharpenings, thats why I do not use them.

 

Your terminology is mixed up.  You don't mean "tang," I'm guessing you mean "finger guard."  The "tang" is the part of the blade that's inside the handle (or between the handle scales).  You also don't mean "belly."  A "belly" describes the convex curve of the knife's blade as it approaches the edge.  You're talking about a concave notch which develops from bad sharpening technique around the bottom of the finger guard.

 

It's a good idea for sharpeners to learn to deal with the finger guard.  Most modern finger guards are part of the bolster rather than the blade, and made from a softer alloy.  Most sharpeners grind the fingerguards  down flat along with the edge, to prevent notching.  It's a good idea to be prophylactic and grind the fingerguard down before a notch develops. 

 

I take care of the finger guard whenever I sharpen with a coarse stone to repair or profile.  If you have a belt sander (I don't), it's no problem at all.  Paranthetically, it's a good idea to re-profile your edges with a coarse stone at least every fifth or sixth time you sharpen to keep them properly thin, correct sharpening errors like bellies getting flattened over time, etc.

 

As long as we've drifted into the subject of what I do and like, let me be very clear I'm not trying to tell you not to like your knives or that you're doing something wrong.  We all have different experiences.  Cooking -- especially for pros like you -- is about as results oriented as anything can be, and if it works for you it works for you.  Also, I don't mean to invalidate in any way the accuracy of what you're trying to communicate to other people -- rather to provide an unbiased balance.

 

BDL


Edited by boar_d_laze - 8/23/10 at 8:52am
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post #22 of 41

super old thread i know...

 

i have had my 10" chroma for a while, and i do love the knife...several friends of mine -- also chefs -- do not like them.

 

i guess its a matter of personal prefference.

 

but ill give a +1 for the chroma.

post #23 of 41

I'll have to throw out a few points that I readily admit are just SWAG's on my part as I'm one of those guys that's never used the knives.  But first off, how can a completely smooth, untextured polished steel handle not be slippery?  You must be blessed with minimal sweat glands; I tend towards the clammier end of the spectrum.  I really dislike how a steel handle feels jarringly cold when you first start using it, then distractingly warm as you keep holding it.  I find akin to sitting on a pleather couch in the summer or sitting down in a chair immediately after a large-ish person gets out of it.  And what is that metal "button" or protrusion all about?  It doesn't join the blade to the handle, does it?  It appears to be one peice.  To me it looks like a design widget glued on to make it look trendier.

 

And while F.A. Porche is widely lauded for their creative designs, who the hell decided a knife handle should be creative?  In nearly every case I can think of breaking from the traditional ends up making a wildly unusable knife.  For examples, check out the Shun Onions...all I can say is Ken must have watched a lot of Star Trek: TNG, because it looks like a Bat'leth would if that Bat'leth was designed by Gil Hibbens.  And the look is much better than the feel.  It's simply awful.  The shape of a knife handle is an instance where form must follow function; the shape of hand should dictate it, not the desire to win an IDEA award.  What does Porsche know about knife design?  Perhaps not as much as they think.

 

Okay, some of this is tongue-in-cheek, so please- minimal flames!  Admittedly I've not experienced the wonder that is the F.A. Porche designed Chroma knife.  So please forgive me, I know not what I do.lol.gif

"Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but we rather have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit." - Aristotle
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"Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but we rather have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit." - Aristotle
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post #24 of 41

my Chef owns one that was handed down to him doesn't use it for anything to important but I have gotten my hands on it before holds and edge well and 

          not too uncomfortable if your not already used to a particular feel ;)

post #25 of 41

Well I may be coming to this thread pretty late - just stumbled on it whilst buying some new Porsche 301 knives online - but thought I'd post anyway as I've used mine for 7 years and love them.

 

I'm not a professional chef, just a pretty decent home one.

and I don't spend hours every day holding them, just the usual home use.

 

But as a woman with small hands, a love for good design, and wants her knife to just 'fit' - I haven't tried any better.

They aren't chunky, they are a beautiful weight in the hand and always feel balanced.

 

The flat top design may look strange to some of you, but to me I don't even notice it  - I find it gives a great lateral control.

(I have to admit though that the cleaver doesn't feel quite weighted correctly)

 

So sorry to the haters out there, but I have yet to find a better knife for me

 

Oh and I'm based in the UK for those who question the Brits decision making on this subject :-)

 

K

(PS - For those of you into your 'top chefs' I live a few doors from Heston Blumenthal and he uses Tojiro if you're interested)


Edited by KBevan - 1/26/12 at 3:02pm
post #26 of 41

I use these knives at home (daily) and find them very good.

The handle might look odd, but the flat top to it sits comfortably in your hand and allows you to press down without a narrow edge pushing into your palm like you get with a traditional handle shape. This makes prolong chopping more comfortable.

They also sharpen well with a basic sharpening block.

 

The Japenese chefs knife and the tomato knife are probably the two I use most.

post #27 of 41
Some years ago we have bought a set of Chroma knifes Porsche design nrs P529 and P06. The store where we bought this was “The Bijenkorf” in The Hague, The Netherlands. We believed the knifes were rust proof. But now we notice some rust on ALL the knifes. The people at the Bijenkorf told us that the term of the guarantee was over and asked us if we have the receipt. But it’s over more than 2/3 years ago so we don’t have the receipt anymore. We've paid a lot of money for these knifes because we thought we've bought real quality. In mine opinion is when a product is sold as rustproof that this means forever and not for a specific periode. Wehave  never cleaned them in a dishwasser

We are vey disappointed

post #28 of 41

Anything made of iron can rust - even if it is "stainless"

 

As one sailing friend puts it, "Stainless means just that.  It stains less.  It doesn't mean stain-free".

 

Anything made of steel needs to be cleaned moderately quickly after use.  And then it needs to be dried, fairly quickly.  And then it needs to be stored where it will remain dry.

 

"Stainless" steel works when the steel is exposed to air - so the surface chromium atoms can bind to oxygen molecules and form a chromium oxide patina.  Put a "stainless" knife in standing water - and the knife will rust.

 

Simple as that.

 

Galley Swiller

post #29 of 41
Instead of leaving it into water, another excellent option to cause oxidation is leaving it dirty on more or less damaged parts, especially with some acidic stuff. Tomato sauce on the edge is great for both dulling and rust.
But a dishwasher is in this respect very effective as well.
Edited by Benuser - 12/4/13 at 9:43am
post #30 of 41

VG10 can rust right in the kitchen, I can tell you that first hand, and that is premium priced stainless considerably above the alloy that porche uses. 440 series will also rust and pit just sitting in a leather sheaf long enough, I have a $600+ Randall did just that. I have some cheap stainless knives from decades ago that have never tarnished the slightest, but I'd trade them in an instant for ones made of s110v, or even half-decent made 440.

 

Rick

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