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Salt in fryer oil

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 
In the McD's Chicken Selects thread welldonechef said:

I'm hoping for a reference or citation for this claim. Or a citation to refute it.

I have certainly experienced herbs burning in fryer oil and so I can understand the claim about seasoning ruining frying oil.

But the salt claim seems suspect to me. Salt is an ionic bond and is easily disassociated in water. But I don't see it in oil in any visible way. Nor do I see a few chlorine or sodium ions breaking down frying oil quickly.

I suppose you could point to water and dissolved protein being released into the oil more from salted products and that causing oil breakdown. But that's not the salt itself.

I'm not saying it's impossible. But I think I would have seen it discussed technically before.
Palace of the Brine -- "I hear the droning in the shrine of the sea monkeys." Saltair
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Palace of the Brine -- "I hear the droning in the shrine of the sea monkeys." Saltair
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post #2 of 15
I am attaching a link from Pitco Fryers. Hope this clears up any questions you have.

Enemies Of Oil
Taste: The sensation derived from food, as interpreted thru the tongue to brain sensory system.
Flavor: The overall impression combining taste, odor, mouthfeel and trigeminal perception.
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Taste: The sensation derived from food, as interpreted thru the tongue to brain sensory system.
Flavor: The overall impression combining taste, odor, mouthfeel and trigeminal perception.
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post #3 of 15
Thread Starter 
That's a good start. But I'd like to know more about the chemical reaction it says happens.

Phil
Palace of the Brine -- "I hear the droning in the shrine of the sea monkeys." Saltair
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Palace of the Brine -- "I hear the droning in the shrine of the sea monkeys." Saltair
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post #4 of 15
Phil,
I have contacted a friend who is an oil scientist and works for an oil manufacturer so I can get the info you are requesting. I should have an answer for you in the next day.
Taste: The sensation derived from food, as interpreted thru the tongue to brain sensory system.
Flavor: The overall impression combining taste, odor, mouthfeel and trigeminal perception.
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Taste: The sensation derived from food, as interpreted thru the tongue to brain sensory system.
Flavor: The overall impression combining taste, odor, mouthfeel and trigeminal perception.
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post #5 of 15
Interesting. All I know is that when I worked the fryer, I was always told to keep the salt away from it, and never to return undercooked food to the fryer if it had already been salted. No one ever said why, so I too am curious.
"Notorious stickler" -- The New York Times, January 4, 2004
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"Notorious stickler" -- The New York Times, January 4, 2004
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post #6 of 15
Thread Starter 
I appreciate the knowledge and connections of this site to answer such arcana.

Phil
Palace of the Brine -- "I hear the droning in the shrine of the sea monkeys." Saltair
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Palace of the Brine -- "I hear the droning in the shrine of the sea monkeys." Saltair
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post #7 of 15
well found this: Your oil guide to well controlled oils it says:
Foaming:

Foaming, which resembles beer foam, occurs when oil degrades due to high temperatures and over-use. This oil should immediately be discarded. The following can contribute to premature foaming:
Salt: Excess salt may be added especially during rush hours resulting in foam formation through soap formation and direct oil breakdown.


seems it acts as a catalyst for oxidation of the oil according to this :

http://www.rbmag.co.za/live/content.php?Item_ID=132


Here at least is a slightly better description: Frying Information
"In those days spirits were brave, the stakes were high, men were real men, women were real women, and small furry creatures from Alpha Centauri were real small furry creatures from Alpha Centauri. "
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"In those days spirits were brave, the stakes were high, men were real men, women were real women, and small furry creatures from Alpha Centauri were real small furry creatures from Alpha Centauri. "
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post #8 of 15
[QUOTE=phatch;269291]I appreciate the knowledge and connections of this site to answer such arcanh/



Bad or rancid oil is caused when a morsel of food is cooked in hot deep fat, the water on the surface and all foods contain moisture reacts with the fat and it hydrolyzes it, therefore freeing all the fatty acids. The fatty acids over time build up and eventually decompose therefore making the oil smoke. The more this fat is used, the more it will smoke.The fatty acids combine and darken and make the oil thick like pancake syrup. Daily straining and filtering will prolong the life, but once it starts to smoke, I feel its gone, because it is at this point that it forms Acrolein which makes ones eyes water and possibly other carcinogenic chemicals. They keep working and experimenting with the various oils to try and make them last longer, but over the years really have not succeeded that much.:D
p/s Since salt to a point is a food I would agree with the salt and spice theory.
CHEFED
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CHEFED
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post #9 of 15
Wow, look at the responses here. Honestly, I learned about the rules for fryer use in cooking school. There are 4 things that are enemy to frying oil (according to my notes from school, 10 years ago!)

Water
Salt
Oxygen
Polymer

Water causes hydroxation (I think that is what it was called), which literally attacks the oil. This causes your food to have an off taste. THis is why you are supposed to rinse your fryer in vinegar, because soap particles left behind speed up the water molecules.

Salt - IIRC, the salt has impurities in it that mimic? copper. See, fryers are made of stainless because they found that any contact with copper would adversely shorten your oil's life span by oxydizing the oil and lowering the smoke point. The longer your oil stands at the smoke point, the faster your oil breaks down.

Oxygen - How your oil is stored, how long it is heated up before you use it, any other problems such as water and salt are exacerbated by oxygen.

Polymer - This one sounds weird, until you think about it. That gunk that builds up on your fryer NEEDS to be cleaned off. It is produced through polymerization. (Where your oil becomes that sticky, gummy substance in your fryer that is impossible to clean off.) If your oil is allowed to come into contact with it, it will start to break things down rapidly.

So, I hope that is good. I can cite references if anyone wants, but I am afraid they might be from my cookbooks at home. :)

Hope that helps someone!

Jason Sandeman

http://jasonsandeman.com

Developing Systems So You Can Cook

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Jason Sandeman

http://jasonsandeman.com

Developing Systems So You Can Cook

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post #10 of 15
Thread Starter 
I'm just a home cook, no pro schooling. Fairly widely read though. I'd enjoy the book references if you can find them.

I knew about light, heat, air, water.

The polymerization is essentially forming a plastic. I run into it mostly on poorly seasoned cast iron. The oil pooled or was on too thick and perhaps not heated high enough to burn off.
Palace of the Brine -- "I hear the droning in the shrine of the sea monkeys." Saltair
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Palace of the Brine -- "I hear the droning in the shrine of the sea monkeys." Saltair
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post #11 of 15
Ever since I can remember I was told about salt degrading oil more quickly and that one should avoid getting any salt in the fryers, yet I was also always told to season my breading well. Always seemed a contradiction to me, but never really questioned it.
post #12 of 15
>>season the breading

Alton Brown did a spot on (I think it was pan fried chicken) where he suggested seasoning the chicken _before_ breading. the theory was the seasonings stayed put vs falling off.

I've had that on my list of round toit experiments - anyone tried that?
post #13 of 15
What there are talking about is salting the food in the basket over the fryer. God only knows how much SALT is in Breadings, Prefab frozen foods like Burritos, pizza pockets, corndogs, chicken strips, breaded fish and shrimp.............I would worry more about the amount of water that comes off French fries than the amount of salt in foods..........All of the prefab foods are full of salt.................In most cases Chefs make their own batters, breadings, that go into the fryer, If the salt isn't in the bredding or batters its no big deal. All fried foods should be salted as soon as they come out of the fryer and out of the fryer basket.............Mc Donalds did a test years ago asking people to try fries without ketchup and only salt. They then asked them to omit the sait and only use ketchup. almost all the people said they had to have the salt but could do without the ketchup.....................Bill
post #14 of 15
I've always believed & passed on the 'superstition' and that's why I felt guilty deep frying capers....but they're so good I got over it!!:D
"Life is what happens to us while we are making other plans."
Allen Saunders, 1957.
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"Life is what happens to us while we are making other plans."
Allen Saunders, 1957.
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post #15 of 15
Thanks for the link friend.
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Secret recipes of the famous restaurants have been revealed!
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