Nationalistic Herbs - Page 2

The problem with cilantro is mostly the dose. Too much seems to taste "soapy" for many, a bit like the ginger experience. I like cilantro in not overdosed quantities. I often heard it being called Maroccan parcely. One advantage over parcely; you can use the stalks too like in a salad or couscous.

I couldn't help laughing when the question was asked wether ketchup is a herb. Reminds me of something I read -a long time ago- when Ronald Reagan had tried to put ketchup on the schools vegetable list!

Oh dear, I love the much-maligned cilantro.

And marjoram, which seems to be an orphan.  Is it not associated with any particular country or cuisine?

Marjoram seems to be the cultivated variant of (the wild) oregano.

How about lovage with that strong celery taste; 1 leaf is mostly enough.

Lemon verbena; saw a cook make mayo with an oil infused with it.

Kaffir leaves; very strong but soft lemon taste.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisBelgium 

... I always seem to associate the smell of garlic+oregano with Italy. Ever seen a pizza without oregano?

 Oh dear, and the battle begins.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KYHeirloomer 

 

If that don't work, a few money-hmmms will do it. Otherwise, next step is Prozac.

Or ouzo.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by KYHeirloomer 

Except cilantro which is evil.

 

I'm beginning to wonder if anybody really likes cilantro.

I used to hate the stuff, used to think it tasted like soap. Now I've grown to love it and put it nearly everywhere - mainly because I've grown found of Vietnamese and Thai cooking.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisBelgium 

Same thing with unknown sorrel. I would guess very typical french kitchen, but has anyone around here ever used it? I notice some young chefs looking for wild sorrel in nature to use in their dishes.

When I grew up Sorrel was used as a vegetable, not an herb. Usually reserved for "fancy" occasions, and pretty much exclusively as an accompaniment to Salmon. I love the stuff, but have never used it as an herb. But I'd love to try!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishbel 

FrenchFries

I can assure you that in most garden centres in the  UK, from when I was very young (quite a while ago now!) you would be offered Curly parsley (the sort that always used to decorate a bit of fried fish to take the place of a green veg!) or French (not Italian) parsley, the flat, better flavoured variety.  (...)

 

It's also a bit like 'cilantro', the leaf and seed of which we British call coriander - whilst in other countries it is the root that used that name.

BTW Ishbel, do you know how we say "Worcestershire sauce" in French (no way you'll make us pronounce that)? .. "English sauce". That's right. Much less of a mouthful.

Marjoram is used in hungary, i believe.  My hungarian friend used a lot of it and got me interested in it.  I now go for it when i want an herb for meat dishes or soups.  Interesting that it's a version of wild origano.  Is that true?  I have some wild herb i picked up from the mountains in abbruzzo - there was a whole mountain of it, and it smelled wonderful.  I presumed it was thyme.  (maybe influenced by the romantic song "plucking wild mountain thyme all around the purple heather" - though there is no heather here. 

Anyway, i planted it on my terrace and it's doing very well.  I wonder actually what it is, in the end, thyme, marjoram or origano - they;re all so close to each other.  Anyway, i'd say thyme/marjoram are my favorite herbs.)  But i think there must be hundreds of varieties of each, and also the kind of soil any type is grown in must strongly affect its flavor. 

As for cilantro, it doesn;t taste like soap to me, but stink bugs, but nobody seems to know what they are.  It doesn;t matter how little is in a dish, i can detect it, and it ruins it for me, unfortunately.  Makes it hard to appreciate various cuisines.

A little marjoram is good with seafood too, like scallops or haddock.

And I do know what a stink bug is, but I wouldn't associate one with cilantro.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisBelgium 

I like cilantro in not overdosed quantities. I often heard it being called Maroccan parcely. One advantage over parcely; you can use the stalks too like in a salad or couscous.

You can use the parsley stalks too! I use them to flavor stocks, broths, soups, but also tajines, etc. Either leave them whole and take them out at the end, or cut them very finely and leave them in.

However, one advantage of cilantro is you can use the roots too. You see that practice a lot in Thai cooking.

French Fries

It's easier if you actually know how to prounounce the word, it's Woostersheer!  I cringe when I hear foreigners call it Worse sester shyer...

But then, my pronounciation of Japanese ingredients isn't too hot, either!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishbel 

French Fries

It's easier if you actually know how to prounounce the word, it's Woostersheer!  I cringe when I hear foreigners call it Worse sester shyer...

Luckily I have a close English friend who helped me with that. I guess he had pity when he saw me say "Worsh-ter-shtir-shir" etc... seriously I'm sure that word was invented by a cruel English who wanted to make fun of French people.

not sure you could call it an herb or spice but for American how about sassafras?

Root and leaves can be used ... not sure about the bark.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KYHeirloomer 

Majoram and oregano are so closely related as to make no never mind. Just think of majoram and a mild version of oregano and you'll be good to go.

 

Thyme has a totally different flavor profile. I would likely mix majoram and thyme, but not oregano and thyme.

 

Za'taar is also related to them, but is most often translated as hyssop. In the bible, when it talks about the Children of Isreal marking their doors with lamb's blood so the angle of death would pass over them, it says they used hyssop to spread the blood. It was actually za'tarr.

Marjoram is just an imposter.  I'm weary of it.

I mix oregano and thyme all the time, all greeks do.  They grow together so they go together.

I always thought that Zahtar was a mix of spices, much like herbs de provence.  My bottle of Zahtar lists these ingredients:  Hulled sesame seed, Sumac, Thyme, salt, oregano.  I bought it when I was making moroccan flat bread but I don't know what else to use it in.  Can I use it to grill meats?  I'm open to suggestions.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Koukouvagia 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisBelgium 

... I always seem to associate the smell of garlic+oregano with Italy. Ever seen a pizza without oregano?

 Oh dear, and the battle begins.

 If it makes you feel any better KKV, foodies around the world concider the greek oregano to be the very best in the world.

That doesn't eliminate my association with Italy. Maybe it's because I've only been once to Greece, well, Kreta (Crete?) in my life. Stayed in Fodele.

And the Kretan oregano is even better than the regular greek oregano if I do say so myself.  Sometimes I find it in the greek markets but sometimes my Mom goes looking for wild oregano in her nearby hills and sends me some in a care package after she dries it.  The smell of oregano instantly transports me to the hillsides of Krete.  What the heck were you doing in Fodele, there's nearly nothing there... well except for the childhood home of the great El Greco which has absolutely nothing of interest inside of it.  Krete may seem like a small island but the Kretans are a divided bunch, one region hates the other region and blah blah.  I happen to be from a region where nobody likes Iraklion so again I ask, what on earth were you doing in Fodele when there are so many other more beautiful parts of Krete?

KKV, it's off-topic, but since you asked; I stayed at Fodele Beach a beach resort a few kilometers from the village Fodele. Nice long walk to the village by the way. We met a family from Athens at the resort, including "Stavros" who was born on Kreta. He nor I didn't care too much for the beach, so we left the rest behind, took his car and drove through the whole island visiting his family. Too much off-topic but I will remember his singing in Greek, all of his family, the quiet places where no tourist ever comes, his crazy driving especially through the smallest streets where we had to fold the outer mirrors in order to drive through a village, his abundant love for all goodlooking women...

Quote:

Originally Posted by KYHeirloomer 

I'd venture to say, though, that 90% of Americans outside Louisianna have never hkeard of it; even while they enjoy a cold root beer. So I wouldn't agree that it's an herb associated, nationalistically, with the U.S.

Heck, most people in Louisiana, except for old timers and people like me who like blackjack tea, have no idea what sassafras is. Everyone knows file (pronounced fee-lay), which is the powdered form of dried sassafras leaves, but a lot of people don't know where it comes from. It doesn't have a tremendous amount of flavor, just a nice subtle note, and is typically used to thicken gumbo and other soups and stews. Even though it's made from leaves, I tend to categorized file as a spice more than an herb.

So all in all, I would agree that sassafras is probably not essential in American cookery.

My dad and elders made sassafras tea as they said it helped to aid digestion and thin the blood, not to mention that it tastes good.  I remember my dad telling me that it was banned because the FDA had found that it was a carcinogen and caused liver damage.  Afterward the use of it 'in the hills' lessened but was still used without any known problems (by my family at least).  They also made sarsaparilla teas and drinks and as far as I know that's still used today to flavor root beer. 

it's oil can be extracted and used to make MDMA or Exctasy. The leaves commercially used today for File are treated in a way to reduce the oil, thus also reducing the flavor. Caused some upset with Gumbo makers as they protested the loss of flavor.

I think it's silly that it was ever banned. There are also carcinogens found in tomatoes, orange juice, and probably every product that contains preservatives. Just another example of the government freaking out about something and overreacting. Besides, my understanding is that most of the safrole is found in the roots, and not so much in the leaves. I eat them whenever I find a sassafras tree.

ChefBazookas: I don't think sassafras oil has been used for quite some time in the commercial production of root beer, unless the safrole has been removed. However, there are some breweries that still use sassafras oil for flavoring instead of artificial flavorings or extracts.

There was a Jeopardy question about 10 years ago, and the most popular herb in America was sage.  

Quote:

Originally Posted by redzuk 

There was a Jeopardy question about 10 years ago, and the most popular herb in America was sage.  

wow, i find that hard to believe......

did anyone mention mint yet?

joey

oh, sorry...didn't complete the thought process!

mint...

u.s.a....mint julep, mojitos, thin mints, new york patties

indian.....raita(yoghurt, cucumber dip)

middle eastern...tabouleh

greek....lamb, tzatziki

joey

I don't think sassafras oil has been used for quite some time in the commercial production of root beer, unless the safrole has been removed. 

I was referring to sasparilla when I mentioned I thought it was still used to flavor root beer.  I could still be mistaken, though.

Oh ok. I believe sarsaparilla is still widely used, but there are so many different variations of root beer, there is no set flavor. For example, Barq's and A&W are extremely different, but both are still "root beer". Personally, I think Barq's is the best mainstream root beer there is, but that's another debate.

Back to herbage! German food (or Deutsche Küche if you will) uses a good bit of thyme and bay leaves, at least the food that I've had. Also a decent amount of carraway (Kümmel), but that would get us off into the topic of spices.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KYHeirloomer 

I cringe when I hear foreigners call it Worse sester shyer...

 

Did y'all ever see the film "The Russians Are Coming, The Russians Are Coming?" There's an hilarious scene where Theo Bikel and Allen Arken, Russian submariners, are looking at a map of the American Coast. They're going to infiltrate Worchester Island, and spend quite a few minutes arguing back and forth over the pronounciation---with neither of them coming close.

Oh my god, KY, i LOVED that movie - eh MERRR gen see, E vrrree boddy to get off the strrreet