ChefTalk.com › ChefTalk Cooking Forums › Food & Equipment Reviews › Cooking Knife Reviews › Are Shun knives really worth the price
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Are Shun knives really worth the price - Page 6

post #151 of 195
Foodie... Yes, The overall Kai product line is diverse.

I have no problem with diversity of opinion or diversity of product. Information dissemination is difficult, especially when the company is smaller or simply doesn't do good marketing. I get frustrated too.

But continually calling a well established company with a well established product line that sells quite well fraudulent or low quality... Or accusing anyone who's needs are met by that product as "stupid" or "ill informed" is just ridiculous. Many of the poor quality claims just don't pass the sniff test. I'm sure the problem happened... But knives don't spontaneously shatter or chip when cutting soft fruit. They just don't do that.
Edited by BrianShaw - 3/6/16 at 4:50pm
post #152 of 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Alan View Post

This has been addressed Brian, Galley Swiller gave quite a professional and thorough overview of the subject of Shun's marketing strategy, and you should really consider that it is you who is actually naive here.  As Adolf Hitler said, "If you are going to lie to the people, make it a really big lie, they will be less inclined to believe you would try to deceive them with such a lie.  Politicians throughout history have done it with great succes, and Shun has done it, as everyone who knows anything about knife construction is well aware of.

Rick, please don't regress to an insulting attitude. I don't deserve that from you. You don't know me well enough for that. We can have a difference of opinion without calling each other names!

I understood his comments but, although not a marketing guy, took it with a big grain of salt. I know enough about business management and engineering to do that.
Edited by BrianShaw - 3/6/16 at 4:55pm
post #153 of 195
Something I find really really funny when I read all this "Shun stuff" ... is that there are still other people out there in the world completely outside of the internet forum spectrum. People that don't talk about stuff on forums. They've got absolutely no clue in the whole world of the opinions of experts here. On top of that ... there are other forums on the internet that just happen to have a section where threads about knives come up sometimes. What I'm getting at here is that some people actually LIKE their Shun knives and ... get this ... actually think they are the top of the line stuff. Now even better than that ... are you ready? ... Some people actually LOVE their "Cutco" knives. I'm serious here. I used to sell that stuff. People love Cutco. I've never been able to figure it out. Some of these people actually have lots of $$$ too. Clients of mine that enjoy $400 bottles of wine when I cook for them. Crazy rich people. Life is goofy sometimes.

"And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music."

I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'.

Reply

"And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music."

I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'.

Reply
post #154 of 195
I've known a few chefs that loved their Shuns and used them for years, long after the pretty finishes were gone. They're fine knives that cut things - not my cup of tea for work, but I had one at home and liked it fine. I'm just glad the Global craze seems to be over, I really hate globals.
post #155 of 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianShaw View Post

Well, perhaps. As a whole Kai is currently selling about $100M per year. Anyone who thinks the sell that much based on fraudulent claims and screwing people on warantee claims is perhaps just angry or jealous or dillusional.

I don't know why a few random internet dilettantes just can't live and let live.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianShaw View Post


Rick, please don't regress to an insulting attitude. I don't deserve that from you. You don't know me well enough for that. We can have a difference of opinion without calling each other names!

I understood his comments but, although not a marketing guy, took it with a big grain of salt. I know enough about business management and engineering to do that.

 

Brian, and this is not the first time I've pointed this out to you, but the unfavorable response you feel you get from myself and others is always a direct response to your own unfavorable comments.

 

No one was trying to bate you here, I really am not passionate about what other people like in knives, and for myself I was just blowing off steam here after being unacceptably violated by Kai USA.

 

They did not honor their warranty, many have complained of this, and they did further damage to my knife which I also did not ask for, and others have complained of this same thing also, and I actually believe this is intentional on Kai's part and further evidence of their sleaze.  Removing about 50 fold more metal than is necessary to sharpen a knife, aside from sharpening to a ridiculous angle and the likely nefarious intent there, oh come now.

 

And I do not appreciate your inference that I and others here are just angry, or jealous, or delusional internet dilettantes.  So we are more than even here.

 

And given your comments I do question your understanding as well as knowledge of business management and engineering, the latter of which, as a professional opinion, I am quite certain you understand nothing of.

 

So let us regain our senses of humor and move on.

post #156 of 195
Ah, Rick... Dismissive again with no basis other than your arrogant "professional" opinion. Discounting other folks opinion and experience just because it differs from yours is rather short-sighted... And unprofessional, wouldn't you say?

I know you did not get satisfaction and I'm sorry for that. I don't know what else to say. I have had good experiences and not the problems a statistical minority report. And, yes, I believe it is a statistical minority based on the fact that the company is thriving and their product continues to sell. That doesn't happen when there are profound engineering, manufacturing, or customer service defects.

But as for your opinion of me... I have regained my sense of humor; I'm laughing now. Thanks!

Vent away, Amigo. We can have a difference of experience and option, can't we?
Edited by BrianShaw - 3/7/16 at 6:34am
post #157 of 195

yawn

 

Brian you can't help but be dismissive of an individual who one day says shuns are great knives and the next day says they are crap compared to a vintage Forgecraft [which is no great knife in itself].  And is so arrogant in his ignorance as to state that Japanese chefs are all deluded about what sharp knives contribute to product quality.

 

yawn

 

Now enough, let's re-enact the truce we had and go on to enjoy the comments we find agreement in.

post #158 of 195

I do not sling poop here just stating pertinent facts.   And your comments which started out badly have become over the top unacceptable so this has been brought to the moderator's attention.


Edited by Rick Alan - 3/7/16 at 8:12am
post #159 of 195
Fair enough. I welcome a moderators comment.

But I must say that pulling bits and pieces of past discussions and presenting them out of context is completely bewildering and a bit childish. That's the poop slinging... Not your professional assessment of knives, steel, or cutting techniques, or your personal experiences with a particular knife manufacturer.

Truce... Sure... But how about some mutual respect too!
post #160 of 195

I agree.  Please call a truce.

 

This thread reads as if the both of you have something against each other.  You may start another thread about Shun knives consisting and argue there but a lot of good information from a thread can be lost in all the noise.

post #161 of 195
Done. Thanks for your input, Kuan.
post #162 of 195

Kuan rather than debate the merits of Brian's final assault why not just delete all the unproductive comments in the thread.

post #163 of 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianShaw View Post

Get a ceramic hone rod ASAP. You won't regret it.

Steel honing rods have a place for knives, but not the hard steel Japanese knives.

The only steel honing rod I use for Shun is completely smooth, and it gets applied very gently. None of that knife slapping the steel like TV chefs like to do.
Good advice. I actually use a global ceramic hone, and store the hone in an idahone sheath in my knife roll.
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad.
Reply
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad.
Reply
post #164 of 195

Thanks Just Jim, back on topic.

 

MG

post #165 of 195

Shun knives suck.

post #166 of 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by GUXX View Post
 

Shun knives suck.

 

That's pretty blanket IMO.  I have two - a Shun Reserve paring knife that is like a Bob Kramer and a 4" classic paring knife.  The reserve is an excellent knife and the classic is one of their best profiles for that series really the chef's knife should have that profile - very Sab like.  My wife has a classic santoku and while I have to maintain it she like the feel and performance. 

post #167 of 195

Hi BLD.  I want to get my wife a nice 8" Chef knife.  She is a professional chef and her choice is usually MAC.  I am looking for a Japanese knife.  Please help, what would you recommend.  Thanks Nic

post #168 of 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by NCC7 View Post

Hi BLD.  I want to get my wife a nice 8" Chef knife.  She is a professional chef and her choice is usually MAC.  I am looking for a Japanese knife.  Please help, what would you recommend.  Thanks Nic

BDL is no longer here, Nic. You missed him by a couple of years. Read around the numerous threads asking the same question and you will see a rather interesting diversity of opinion and experience.
post #169 of 195
You better open a new thread, but I will try to answer your question, assuming you're looking for a 8" stainless with a Western handle. That 8" bothers me, a bit longer is much more convenient in a professional situation unless working space is a real problem.
The MACs are great knives. Only stainless ones I can imagine above that are the Misono UX-10 series or the Ryusen Blazen.
post #170 of 195

Gesshin Kagero with the western handle (though I think still out of stock) is a potential stainless option, as is Hattori FH. Also last I checked on JCK the Hiromoto Gingami 270mm gyuto is still there, though perhaps a bit over the size requirement.


It would help if you put a rough budget range.

post #171 of 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny P View Post

I'm not prepared to spend almost $500. for a French Knife. Great looking cutlery, but can anyone tell me if they are really worth the price?
post #172 of 195

Wow great action. Really like the enthusiasm that most discussion on some subjects generate. I have some Shuns most are limited edition and are used not that much. they seem good but have other knives that I use more. Have a 2.5-3 lb cleaver that will smack anything you want, even in the garden. I try not to use the more expensive knives near frozen foods or bones or granite tops etc. As for the having legs we had cameras in my place were we served close to 300 tables. you have to be very careful because your knives would get misplaced almost daily if you get the meaning. the workers took me to Dept of labor a couple of times since when you " shut the doors and every bag will be checked same as lockers" apparently violates something or some law. But the knife always was found. Found one in the bathroom or so they said and another in the washing station.

Back to Shun it is a fair company that is in the business. they sell a lot of knives so they will have some problems with some, mass production rule specially with heat treatment and flexibility since some of them are stamped or not treated equally.

would suggest that the person go to surlatable or ws or somewhere that the knife can be handled somewhat so to see if they like the feel or grip. when you use the knife for 3-6 hours per day is a different expierience all along.

sharpening is a different issue.

But as someone said a happy wife is a happy life.

 

As for myself have more than100 knives and counting between mine the ones I got from my grandfathers (owned a slaughter place for bulls, pigs etc.)  house when sold and the one got from my fathers when the house was sold. the sad thing have only two hands.

 

a good saying from Tony Bourdain you don't touch my ...... you don't touch my knife....

post #173 of 195

I just got one of these. It's small like a petty. It came very sharp ootb. I'll sharpen it on an electric CC sharpener until it's past usability, then I'll toss it out and get another knife of the moment for another $5. 

 

 

http://www.pulsetv.com/Copper-Knife-Stays-Sharp-FOREVER/productinfo/7806/

 

https://youtu.be/Gqzvfoacpbo

post #174 of 195
At the risk of asking an actual question about Shun knives...

Someone posted a link or two to Williams Sonoma selling the Shun 6" kiritsuke. I was confused, looked at the site. I'm still confused. In what sense is this a kiritsuke? Seems like a santoku to me.

As far as I know, the kiritsuke was invented in the early-middle 20th C as a single-bevel all-purpose knife for professionals. It's about 8"-10" long, single-beveled, with a gently curved blade and a sharp point; it is also rather heavy, as it has a somewhat thick spine to help it stand up to some abuse.

What is this Shun thing?
post #175 of 195
@ChrisLehrer some brands are selling a double beveled "kiritsuke", one of such versions has a flatter than gyuto blade profile and a narrower/less tall blade. And has a kiritsuke style pointed tip
As for a 6inch version, goodness only knows
post #176 of 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisLehrer View Post

At the risk of asking an actual question about Shun knives...

Someone posted a link or two to Williams Sonoma selling the Shun 6" kiritsuke. I was confused, looked at the site. I'm still confused. In what sense is this a kiritsuke? Seems like a santoku to me.

As far as I know, the kiritsuke was invented in the early-middle 20th C as a single-bevel all-purpose knife for professionals. It's about 8"-10" long, single-beveled, with a gently curved blade and a sharp point; it is also rather heavy, as it has a somewhat thick spine to help it stand up to some abuse.

What is this Shun thing?

not quite all purpose... its specifically supposed to cover the functions of yanagiba and usuba

post #177 of 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by JBroida View Post

not quite all purpose... its specifically supposed to cover the functions of yanagiba and usuba
True, not a deba. Good clarification.

I still think this Shun thing is weird....
post #178 of 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisLehrer View Post


True, not a deba. Good clarification.

I still think this Shun thing is weird....

people be loving that kiritsuke shape... on one hand, i get that it looks cool, and the profile is slightly flatter, but i still just prefer a regular gyuto most of the time.  Also, when it comes to kiritsuke, i still prefer a yanagiba or usuba in function for each of their respective tasks.

post #179 of 195

good discussion.  I guess in Japan if you change the shape of the blade slightly, you can rename it.  also it seems that folks in southern Japan don't like using northern Japanese knife names.  For folks trying to figure out the difference between a kiritsuke or usuba or yanagiba or nakari or deba, try here http://www.zknives.com/knives/kitchen/misc/usetype/all/index.shtml.  find out the difference between a  Ai-deba, a Miroshi deba, a Mioroshi Deba and a Hon Deba.

I have seen Shun knives once.  The sale's lady at Williams/Sonoma needed two keys to open the display case, made sure the glass door was between me and the knives, then showed me blades thru the glass.  

 

Scott just a tired old sailor glad to be home from the sea
Reply
Scott just a tired old sailor glad to be home from the sea
Reply
post #180 of 195
That's very odd , Scott, and sounds like a horrible experience. I've never experienced anything like that... Every W/S I've ever been in was either completely pushy or too casual but never rude. Once in a collectible watch shop and the clerk did something like that to me but told me that he was afraid of snatch-and-run thieves. He was (and still is) a complete odd-ball. You might want to speak to Management because that's just inhospitable treatment for a potential buyer.

Fascinating link... a lot of very specialized knife forms!
Edited by BrianShaw - 5/1/17 at 7:26am
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Cooking Knife Reviews
ChefTalk.com › ChefTalk Cooking Forums › Food & Equipment Reviews › Cooking Knife Reviews › Are Shun knives really worth the price