Considering Culiary School

Hello Derrick,

I feel you brother on changing careers. In 2011 during the 9/11 era I was a retail loss prevention manager. To make a long story short I lost my job because many stores closed down.  I couldn't get another lp job if my life depended on it. Now before I continue I will say I didn't attend culinary school.  What got me where I am today is passion. At the same time I continue to seek every thing and any thing that has to do something with food.  I have many cook books through out my home. I watch many tv shows.  Again passion first and school next. Like you I wish I could attend a credited school.  I emphasize on credited. You have schools like CIA or Cordon Bleu which comes with a price, but well known if your a good student.  Then you have schools like The arts schools which always starts off with the name of the city. It's a chain.  I just had a friend graduate from WAshington DC school of fine arts. Not as credited as some would think.  At the sametime he is questioning his career choice. AS an ITyou have to have some smarts ;). So with that said you would be able to pay attention to detail.  With me, I was the one copying the recipes for my mother as we watched old shows of the one and only Julia Childs.  The only thing with me was that i came from a poor family. Got older and went into the military. Cooking wasn't glorified as it is today.  It's like when the show COPS came out. Every one wanted to be a police officer.  Owning a restaurant can be rewarding.  It's does come with a lot of responsibilities.  I've opened a few restaurants knowing the legal, physical, and operational parts.  I'm about to be interviewed for a neighborhood restaurant. Very popular with the community. They are opening another location.  Why am I telling you this is because the owner is a computer science graduate form Chicago.  She gave computer software programming a shot, and now she is a restaurant owner.

So I hope this helped you. Oh yea I started off as a dishwasher and told the chef I was tired of washing his dishes.

www.cheesetique.com

www.facebook/myittybittykitchen

Never compromise quality.

There are many threads about this topic, please look them up.

I strongly suggest--no I insist, on getting a job in the kitchen first, school later.

Pay for cooks sucks--big time.  For Chefs, it may sound great, but you are working a minimum of 80hrs/wk.

Hope this helps

Derrick,

I am in the middle of changing career fields, and going back to college.  Thankfully, I had planned on this and with that bit of foresight I decided to apprentice under a chef, under whom I've been learning for the last three years when I wasn't busy at my job with the military.  I too, was an analyst, and did a lot of IT related jobs...so I understand where you're coming from and your researching the living daylights out of this before jumping in.  I've spent a lot of time doing that as well.  As for going to culinary school, it's a great thing if you want to sink the money into it.  My chef told me that although he went to culinary school, it's just as good of training to work in a kitchen and apprentice under a chef.  Which is what I ended up doing.  I wish you the best of luck as you venture into this, and am always up for a chat if you'd like.

Regards,

Paul

There seems to be a few IT people out there that have moved into food services.  I too, worked at an IT company and was laid off in 2010 with a nice severance package.  This gave me the time (couple of months) to think about what I wanted to do with my life.  Jump back into the corporate world (I worked in Purchasing) or pursue a passion of mine.  I came to the decision that life was too short to dislike what I do so I did go to school.  Upon graduation, I started looking for work and got a job working at a catering company in Toronto.  I'm very happy and even though the work is hard and the hours are long, it doesn't feel like work and I don't hate getting up in the morning (even on those 6:30-7:00 am start times).  We about to head into the Christmas season our most busy period which is scary, but exciting too.

Now the money is not great and you will need to decide if you can live on what you will be making.  I would also recommend having a good long think about this step.  Working in a professional kitchen is not the same as working at home.  The pace is quicker, you will be expected to work on several things at once and amount of food is larger.  Also can you body take standing for over 9 hours a day, lifting heavy items and knowing you will get injurer (I've had burns and minor cuts so far). 

I hope to hear more about your decision.

Hi Derrick,

I would encourage you to keep your discussion in this thread and not PM Cinnamon girl as I think it is very useful for people.

I did the exact reverse of what you are doing I was in the culinary field since I was a teen and left to go into IT. CinnamonGirl is right on it is a very tough business and you will work way more hours than you ever did in IT and make less than half for a long time. I would really encourage you to think long and hard about this. A lot of people "love to cook" and are very "passionate" about it but being a chef in the restaurant industry really means so much more.You have to love being a chef, running a kitchen, devoting your whole life to it. I think Andre Soltner the Chef/Owner of Lutece in New York said it best. Upon retiring he told an interviewer that he and his wife gave their life for the restaurant.

If you are truly passionate about getting into the culinary field be sure to explore the many different facets of it. One area that I think works out very well for chefs is teaching. You can give private cooking lessons or eventually work at a vocational school. It is very rewarding, has benefits, and the hours are reasonable.

Derrick,

When I thought about about going into the culinary field, I never thought I could work on the line at a restaurant, never mind running one.  The pace alone would do me in.  I agree with Nicko about exploring other areas of the business, teaching, private lessons, catering, working for an institution (hotels, corp kitchens, hospitals...etc).  You will get better paid and benefits.

I'm working with cooks who have been in the culinary field for almost 20 years and I can see the toll this job has done on their bodies.  You're starting out older and will need to work smarter not to hurt yourself and to keep up with the young bucks in the kitchen.

Out of school, your starting hourly salary will be around $10.00 to $14.00.  Working 6, 9 hour days a week, that's $540 to $756 a week before taxes.  I can take the cut in pay because my husband has a very good job, but I'm making more than half of what I making at my previous job.

Have a look at several job websites to see what's out there:  Hospitalityserve.com, All Chef Jobs in Canada (wowjobs.ca)

I don't mean to sound so disparaging.  I've landed a job at a good place, I like my Chef, I like my co-workers and I'm learning lots.  I hope the same for you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derrick Young 

...Hell for the 18k culinary school is going to cost me I could put in some pretty nice appliances in my own kitchen and learn on my own.

You are not wrong!
 

Derrick,

I think you should ditch culinary school I am no longer a fan of it. You can learn everything they teach you and more working for a good chef and choosing the right library. I also think you should consider something other than working a hot line which is fun when your young but later in life it just gets hot and tiring. The pay cut is going to be the biggest hit for you no question about it.

Lastly, have a long hard talk with your wife and make sure she is ok with you being gone just about every eveing, every weekend and many holidays. The light went on for me about the restaurant biz when I called a good friend of mine who was working as a chef at Opri Land on Christmas morning. His wife said I just missed him. He watched the girls open their presents and then went to work. I guess my point is Derrick that this decision is going to have a huge impact on your family so make sure you are all on board and on the same page.

Nicko

This is a great article from one of our long time members Pete. Outstanding chef, worked at all the high end places. What is he doing now? Manages a food service program for the Wisconsin correctional facilities. 

http://www.cheftalk.com/a/confessions-of-a-quot-sell-out-quot-chef

Amen Paul,

I couldn't agree more.

Hello,

There were many times that I wished I went to culinary school. As I grew older and wiser I'm glad I started off as a dishwasher.  I know friends that are still paying back their loans.  Start creating a network Darrick because as unfair as it may sound it's who you know.  There's many resources out there that can teach you the in and outs.  The business can be cut throat. Expect to be sent home early when you are hourly.  This happens when the business is slow.  Do your homework. Ask questions when it comes to when they are slow.  There were many times I was asked to go home because there were no hours. When I finally reached supervisor status. Asking employees to go home was the hardest part of my job. Don't allow me to scare you, but as long as you have passion you will go far.

Derrick you seem like a very smart person, but for every person I ever met that said they had a passion for cooking and never saw again after two weeks I would not have to work at all,but I believe in dreams and If your dream is the culinary field then make it work. I am one of those guys that didn't go to culinary school and I found fate on my side and got the jobs that I wanted not the jobs that would have me. I worked for some heavy hitters in the hospitality industry and I always enjoyed it. Of corse the places I worked at, I couldn't afford to eat at  but sometimes you feel like a rock star working in these places, but my paycheck always kept me grounded somehow. I was extremely lucky in my career, but I was truly focused also. I have had wine over a hundred years old, cooked for Julia Child at a James Beard foundation dinner, rockstars, actors, former presidents, there is nothing like it. When you can make magic out of a few ingredients and be complimented it truley is gratifying. I know It can be done, I hope you want it enough to have done the same, because no one can take it away from you, no matter how small the paycheck is. whether you want a small restuarant or to be a master chef, do what you need to do to get there. It is hard but isn't everything hard to someone. It really is an industry that can be truley magical.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rekonball 

 I know It can be done, I hope you want it enough to have done the same, because no one can take it away from you, no matter how small the paycheck is. whether you want a small restuarant or to be a master chef, do what you need to do to get there. It is hard but isn't everything hard to someone. It really is an industry that can be truley magical.

I think when you are married and have a family it is more than just what "you" want. You have to make sure that it is also what your family wants. For me family comes first and if your passion and drive are pushing to work 80 hours a week and your never home then that in my opinion is the wrong decision.

Don't get me wrong Derrick I had a great time working in the field, but what I am saying is count the cost. 

Derrick, could you meet with a couple of Chefs in your area to get a better idea of the work environment in your area.  They may give you some insight as to what is available in your area.  Maybe you don't have to go to culinary school.  

As for the age thing, I'm older and I do have a harder time keeping up with the younger folk at work.  Nature of the beast I guess.  But what you can bring to the table is a work ethic, be dependable, have a willingness to do anything (in a day I can bounce between:  working mains/savory, desserts, appetizers, shopping, delivery and dish washing) and learn quickly.  This goes a long way with an employer. 

I have a good idea of the school you're looking at, by the amount and school weeks you mentioned.  The program is good, but because each campus an owned franchised and it is taught slightly different based on the owner's/instructors strengths.  Do your diligent. 

Bill and Derek, I too felt the pain in 2010 when there was a downfall in the economy and it was difficult to meet the quota in my IT role.

Where I am now sounds quite distant to everyone else is in this conversation.

I'm part of a team in a cooking school in Melbourne www.frontcookingschool.com.au, so I'm not sure if my feedback about chefs in my area are of any relevance.

The economic downfall was quite delayed in Australia (just as everything else is!) but it did eventually arrive, and everyone cut back on spending naturally.

18+ months on-wards, I think we are at the start of the cycle when everything picks up again, and people will be saying in 3-4 years from now;

"I wish I had an opportunity to start up a business 4 years ago"

We're all part of a repeating cycle, it's about knowing when to make the move.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicko 

I think when you are married and have a family it is more than just what "you" want. You have to make sure that it is also what your family wants. For me family comes first and if your passion and drive are pushing to work 80 hours a week and your never home then that in my opinion is the wrong decision.

 

Don't get me wrong Derrick I had a great time working in the field, but what I am saying is count the cost. 

 

Yes my family is first, when my wife started a family I had peaked as far as pay and benefits(so I thought) I got out for a little bit that alowed our family to grow. I knew a lot of people who were working 80 hours a week never saw they're family and I didn't want to be like them, so I built elevators for a while and made more money than I ever thought I could as a chef, unless you are an executive chef in a fine hotel or something,but no more money means no more jobs, and I have come back to my first profession. One of the  chef that I worked for at a very high end hotel, he was never home and was alway at work. I got out made some money and  even though I was doing well I needed more for my family and I chose to leave it behind at that time. Even though I would like to make the same money as before in the elevator industry, I do find myself just a little happier doing something I love and have always loved to do.   

 

Lol I like you saying you're too anal and spelling too wrong and allot also wrong... you're doing fine . Quite funny reading your post, I've been working in IT for a fairly long time myself and am asking myself exactly the same questions...really want to dump it and get on to something more "human". I've started a cooking website for the fun but am thinking of taking things a bit further in some direction or other. The beauty of the food industry is that there are so many different outlets... ok so being a top chef is like being the king but even the peasants get to have their fun in the cooking world and can one day become king...unlike the real world

I think culinary school has it's pro's and con's. It opens a lot of doors on the one hand, but on the other it's broad and you don't specialize in one thing for any length of time. You get basic skills and techniques based on classical cooking and it takes a while to get any return on culinary school financially because you start at the bottom of the rung. The hours are just as bad or worse than most other fields and the pay is not that commensurate. You can usually find a job during hard times and never go hungry. It's a labor of love for the first five or ten years, but then the payoff of accolades and instant gratification for making something someone enjoys right away starts to grey. I would recommend specializing in something and doing it really well. There's a computer guy in Chicago making brisket for the last nine months and he's happy and packed every day. I went to CIA and did fine dining for years and all that and I got into artisan baking and although I made less, I was much happier and didn't learn it in culinary school. It depends on what you want. You know what you don't want to do. That's a start.

I wanted to go to culinary school instead of college, but my parents didn't allow it.   So I've been doing the IT thing for 22 years, and it's been really good to me.    My kids are in college now, and I started a little food based business on the side that I have found to be really interesting.   I rent space in a commercial kitchen,  and have taken a handful of classes over the past couple of years that have given me some basics I really need.  I've met quite a few chefs, and have determined that I don't want to work in a restaurant kitchen - the lifestyle would be bad for me.   Plus, I don't think I can stand on my feet for that many hours any more.     Is there any way you can do something similar, without going 'all or nothing'?   For what it's worth, I am pretty pleased with my success, and anticipate at least 100% growth for next year.   But I can't live on it, yet.  But, I have my IT job, so this is kind of like a really great hobby that makes me money.     

Quote:

Originally Posted by edward 

I think culinary school has it's pro's and con's. It opens a lot of doors on the one hand, but on the other it's broad and you don't specialize in one thing for any length of time. You get basic skills and techniques based on classical cooking and it takes a while to get any return on culinary school financially because you start at the bottom of the rung. The hours are just as bad or worse than most other fields and the pay is not that commensurate. You can usually find a job during hard times and never go hungry. It's a labor of love for the first five or ten years, but then the payoff of accolades and instant gratification for making something someone enjoys right away starts to grey. I would recommend specializing in something and doing it really well. There's a computer guy in Chicago making brisket for the last nine months and he's happy and packed every day. I went to CIA and did fine dining for years and all that and I got into artisan baking and although I made less, I was much happier and didn't learn it in culinary school. It depends on what you want. You know what you don't want to do. That's a start.

Good point Edward, the process of elimination is often a good way to decide what you want to do, but what if you have so many things you want to do??!

Running a culinary school is very tricky because very few people think of cooking schools. The average person learns cooking at home from their parents and only when it flares up their passion for food do they look to pursue this path - which is often eliminated in the above-mentioned process!!!

I've spoken to so many people and have received so much feedback that people generally would love to learn to cook superbly, but never dedicate their time to it.

One of the most popular ways we get new students in our classes is after they've sampled food from our Bistro.

This way, people see it, taste it, smell it or feel the texture and it triggers their desire to want to learn it.

A two pronged approach may be necessary to make a successful Culinary School.

What is everyone's thoughts on this?
 

After 25 years in sales, I enrolled in Culinary school.  Best decision I ever made.  There are so many opportunities in the industry right now.  You can take your culinary knowledge and use it in so many ways. As an older chef to be, I recommend doing a "stage" or internship when you start school to experience the many different types of kitchens out there ie hotel vs resaurant vs catering, etc.  good luck and go with your intstincts.