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Best stainless yo-gyuto on the 250-300 U.S.D ?

post #1 of 11
Thread Starter 

Hi guys...

 

I'm planning on getting a new toy and what I'm looking for ,is a new gyuto with western handle and made of  stainless steel, as you all know I own a Mac that really made me happy and I still consider it my best knife, I have some Tojiros too wich I like a lot, but I realized that despite how sharp they get and how easy is to take them to razor sharp... I'm not so happy with the stains, discoloration of kourochi finish, and patinas that carbon steel gets.

 

I'm getting a Konosuke "lasser" but besides that one, I want something a bit more sturdy like a regular gyuto... Something that you consider better than a Mac. No "bling" factor, no fancy stuff... Pure performance.

 

As usual my priorities are:

 

-Has to be able to get scary sharp.

-Easy to get that sharp.

-Good edge retention.

 

Any suggestions?

 

Best regards.

Luis.

post #2 of 11

Do you want thin or do you want everyday workhorse?

post #3 of 11

Are you kidding here?  With a range of $250-$300 the choices are all over the place.  LOL.  This thread is gonna be all over the menu.

"And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music."

I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'.

Reply

"And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music."

I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'.

Reply
post #4 of 11
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by racineboxer View Post

Do you want thin or do you want everyday workhorse?


Hi Racineboxer... I'm looking for a workhorse, not a "laser", it has to be an sturdy knife capable of outperform a Mac. biggrin.gif

 



Quote:
Originally Posted by IceMan View Post

Are you kidding here?  With a range of $250-$300 the choices are all over the place.  LOL.  This thread is gonna be all over the menu.


I'll not complain if the knife is cheaper than that, basically I mean that I don't mind spending up to 300 USD if necessary. For example... I like a lot the Kikuichi Warikomi Damascus but despite how nice it looks, and the fact that it's a brand that I trust, looks like a lot of the money that it costs is invested on the looks department, and at this point that's not what I'm looking for. 

But if for some reason I find a knife that meets my criteria under the 250 USD... I'll be more than happy.smile.gif

 

Since several months ago I have the idea of getting a Masamoto HC carbon but if it gets as care demanding as the Tojiros (shirogami) I'll get tired soon, maybe not all carbons are that sensitive and I'm getting the wrong idea, but so far, dealing with a knife that discolors that fast and gets rusty and stained that easy is not what I want.

Another knife that I'm considering is the Konosuke HD yo-gyuto but I have to do a bit more of research on that one.

 

I'm still looking for advice and suggestions, all your feedback will be very welcome.thumb.gif

 

post #5 of 11

I'm not sure if workhorse+stainless+super sharp/edge retention is a combination that is all that common to find.  It seems to me that most people who want super sharp/edge retention will go with carbon or semi-stainless and often go with thinner knives.

 

 

Perhaps the Hiromoto AS might be a knife to keep on your radar.  It has the AS super core which is carbon and will patina but it's only along the first handful of mm's of the edge, the rest of the blade is "protected" or clad with stainless.  So you'll be able to get it super sharp, and have great edge retention, and still have some heft to have that workhorse type of feel.  I love this knife and want one with a wa handle.

 

 

Semi-stainless options like Kikuichi TKC, Konosuke HD and Carbonext might suit you.  Not completely stainless but from my experience they behave more like stainless than they do carbon.  I'm not sure if the Konosuke HD is thinner than the other two or if it's just the wa handle that gives it the super light feeling.  I think people generally feel the TKC and Carbonext are good everyday, all purpose, workhorse gyutos.  I had the Carbonext and I have a Mac Pro and I definitely give a big edge to the Carbonext as a cutter.  It was thinner behind the edge, more flexible and nimble, and the semistainless was easier to get really sharp and stayed sharp longer.  Mine had no fit & finish issues either.  And it had enough heft to it that I felt like it was a good workhorse knife (I'm mainly using a sakai yusuke in stainless right now and it's definitely thinner, feels more fragile, and it's not hard enough for your edge requirements).

 

 

Another option, but it'll probably be out of your price range, would be something from Devin Thomas.  But he makes some top notch stuff in stainless.

 

A couple more to consider:

Hattori - the "forum" knife.

Ryusen - the one from epicurean edge (not the one from CKTG).  I've never handled this knife but I did have one SG2 "powder" steel knife and it was pretty friggen hard.  Powder steels seemed popular for a while but I don't see as many recommendations for them anymore.  Everyone these days seems to be drooling over semistainless, AEB-L or the newest - M-390.

 

 

post #6 of 11

There aren't many carbons significantly less demanding than Shirogami.  If that's too much work for you, forget carbon. 

 

The Hiromoto AS isn't much of a step up form a MAC, if it's a step up at all.  It's a good general purpose gyuto which takes and holds a good edge, but I had a few and didn't like them.  I think you can do "the same but better" with a lot of knives -- Sakai Takayuki Grand Cheff for instance.  For that matter, I think the MAC is a better all-around knife.  How about a Masamoto VG? 

 

What exactly do you want to do with the new knife that you're not doing very well already?  General purpose?  Heavy-duty?  

 

The "not a laser," $250 - $300, stainless price range isn't particularly well populated.  Once you start thinking about significant bucks (or pesos), the knives start getting pretty thin.  Thicker, more heavy duty knives tend to be less expensive.  That said, you might want to check out JKI, I think Jon has several knives which are well-made, stainless, and relatively HD in or around that price range. If you see something you like, by all means bring it up here but definitely talk to Jon about it.  You should probably talk to him anyway. 

 

If you want thin but not laser, stainless, wa, I'd definitely consider one of the Richmonds -- even taking a chance on the stainless Ultimatum.  Talk to Mark.

 

While we're on the subject, wa or yo? 

 

Why not wait until you've had a chance to fool around with the Konosuke before deciding what other knives you need (or just want)? 

 

BDL


Edited by boar_d_laze - 3/21/12 at 10:11am
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post #7 of 11
Thread Starter 

Hi everyone...

 

Thanks a lot for your advice, seems like I opened a can of worms here with my request. I was doing some research but I couldn't find by myself an answer. Is not that I "hate" carbon, actually I like a lot how sharp it gets and how easy is to get it that sharp, but seems like I just cann't keep my knife clean (the tojiro) , I have to wipe it every time, and then dry it with another cloth, and sometimes even that way it gets rusty in a matter of hours, besides that very gritty finish makes it annoying. What I already did is to sand those tojiros but even that way they take a rusty finish, I don't mind on patinas, but this ones take a dirty look wich I don't like very much.

 

Maybe some other carbons don't take that ugly look, but so far my experience with carbons are the shirogamy tojiros (A gyuto, a nakiri and a santoku) since I use the santoku and nakiri to carve laquered duck, those ones are not that prone to get ugly, but the gyuto (That I bought just for the sake of giving a try to shirogami steel) that gets some prep action is the one getting troublesome, besides is too small (21 cm, and I'm used to 24 or 10" ).

But as I'm telling you, I got this one to have some experience with carbon and so far, not so good. If all carbon is that sensitive, they will not be my choice for serious line work (truth to be told is that they don't get that much action, BC I became the kind of chef that I hate... The one that gets in the kitchen, works a bit, gets a ton of phone calls, then goes to the office to fight with purveyors, partners, handymen, and that at the rush hour is expediting, and once the service is over I'm socializing with my customers, wich is not my favourite activity but is part of the trade, and at the end I don't spend that much time cooking or cutting).

At the end of the day the knife wont cut tons of produce or meat, but it will get some professional use and probably it's share of abuse.

 

The handle?... I have only experience with the yo handle and the d-shaped wa handle of the tojiros, and so far, I prefer the western handle on the mac than the "D handle" of the Tojiros, but I have zero experience with octogonal. Maybe next week I'll be in Chicago, and if so, I'll order the Konosuke HD wa gyuto, and just like BDL suggests, maybe I'll fool around with that one to see how I feel with that kind of handle, that way I'll get a more solid experience to decide on the new knife.

 

What I'll be doing with the new knife?... Basic prep, no cutting bones or  hard stuff, and this knife is not because my Mac is not fullfiling my expectations, this new knife is just for the sake of experimenting with new stuff, I want to see what's the next level of sharpness in stainless steel,basically is someting that I don't need, is just something that I want.

 

I wanted to take advantage of my trip to the U.S. and get both knives to save the 35 bucks that costs the shipping to Mexico , but seems like the smart thing to do is to wait a bit. Anyway I'll still be checking on all your suggestions because I think that a "laser" is not the best knife to have in a professional kitchen, specially when there is a big chance that one of my fellow cooks take the knife while I go to the office or while I chat with a customer.

 

Thanks a lot to everyone for the imput, I'll check every suggestion that you made.

Luis

post #8 of 11

Hi Louis,

My recommendation for the Hiro AS was based on your priorities which you said were:

-Has to be able to get scary sharp.

-Easy to get that sharp.

-Good edge retention.

 

 

In my personal opinion, the AS super core of the Hiromoto AS would be a huge step up from some of the stainless options in the 58-59 HRC range.  When people talk about the Hiro AS one of the first things that comes up is almost always the edge that it'll take and hold.

post #9 of 11

what do you think about this one? Wa-gyuto but it is seemingly a more, everyday application, sharp as shit, not too expensive. 

 

I might be WAY off here although, I'm thinking of getting this one as my first 10 inch Japanese steel. 

post #10 of 11

Also, I don't know if you're in anyway against Shun Knives but, the classic and reserve series have some nice VG-10 Blades. I use the 8'' classic every day at work and believe it is heavy duty enough. 

post #11 of 11
Quote:
what do you think about this one? Wa-gyuto but it is seemingly a more, everyday application, sharp as shit, not too expensive. I might be WAY off here although, I'm thinking of getting this one as my first 10 inch Japanese steel. 

Which knife? The Hiromoto AS? It's alright. Typical of AS, it takes a good, but not a great edge. Edge retention is very good, which is also typical of AS. The ergonomics aren't very good in that the handle's are short and narrow. and the profile is just OK. Overall, decent value for the money but nothing to write home about.

We had four and passed them on very quickly; but mostly because I don't like cladded knives and my reasons for not liking them may or may not have anything to do with you.

Hiromoto AS were huge darlings of the knife forums a few years ago, but the enthusiasm has tapered off. I'd say they occupied the same niche currently filled by the Kagayaki CarboNext, but the CarboNext is a better knife all in all -- providing you can sharpen.

BDL
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