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Sharpening a knife OOTB...Question

post #1 of 16
Thread Starter 

Hi guys...

 

Finally I could get my first Laser... I'm the proud owner of a Konosuke HD peace.gif I picked the knife last week in Chicago, I was there on a business trip, after that I went to NY and finally after many days with the knife in my luggage I came back  home and I could use the new toy.

 

I'm very impressed and I can tell you that the feeling of this knife is something that I've never felt before, it really falls thru veggies easier than cutting butter with a hot knife. All I can say is WOW ! But when I tried the knife on my forearm, I felt it somehow "gritty" while shaving, so, I know that the knife can do much better. Believe me, I can live with this kind of edge wich already exceeded my expectations, but since I'm a guy that likes to push the envelope, I'm thinking on sharpening it by myself while still is very sharp to get it scary sharp.

 

If the advice is to use it like it is now until it gets dull... I'm fine and I'll listen to your more experienced advice... But if there is no problem on get  sharper a knife that is so new, my question is:

 

Being the knife this new and still very sharp, should I sharpen it until I get the burr starting with a medium grit stone (Bester 1200) or should I just polish it with a 6000-8000 ?

 

That's my question guys!

 

Once I get some hours with the new knife, I'll let you know my impressions as objective as I can. So far I'm very impressed with the fit, finish, balance and performance of the knife. Since I was out of town for many days, now I have a lot to do in the restaurant (More managing less cooking)  and by the time that I can get in the kitchen to "cook", most of the prep is done already, but as soon as I get the chance of hitting sacs and cases of veggies by myself, I'll let you know how the knife performed on heavy duty use.

 

Best regards.

Luis

post #2 of 16

That's a good question, Luis, I hope someone comes along with a set of answers or opinions. I'm glad you asked it, too, because I respect your pedigree. I'm entirely new to Japanese knives as well as proper sharpening, so I have similar questions. My Masamoto KS gyuto was already what I would call extremely sharp OOB when I played with it at the shop, but I got the shop to polish up the edge for me as part of the sale. Using it at home for the first time, I think I could classify it as scary sharp. Busy with my real job, I have not actually used it much in the two months I have had it so its edge is still like new. But I wonder if I should have a go at it with the EP and finer Choseras now, or wait until I notice it starting to be less scary.

 

Yesterday I picked up a blue steel nakiri that is fairly sharp, but I am quite certain the edge needs to be cleaned up. What should I do with it? Start medium-fine and progress through the Choseras?


Edited by SameGuy - 4/11/12 at 6:50pm
post #3 of 16

Knifes are different (LAM!, duh) what I mean is they are designed different, check the angle of the grind on your knife and consider increasing it slightly, incrementally until you reach (your) knife Nirvana. Obviously it will dull sooner than the manufactured designed and in some cases is not recommended for cleavers etc.

IMHO and experience, BEFORE you adjust/augment the original angle, polish it and try the old stroping method on leather or folded newspaper.

 

Cutlery makers put a lot of thought/time/$ into a design, IMHO, give credit to their process. That being said, each Chef is unique and uses the tools of the trade in their own cadence, so no one size, fits all.

 

Cheers!

 

EDG

"Ars Est Celare Artem"

 

True art, is to conceal art......

 

https://www.instagram.com/smokehouse_84/

Reply

"Ars Est Celare Artem"

 

True art, is to conceal art......

 

https://www.instagram.com/smokehouse_84/

Reply
post #4 of 16
I would assume you would decrease the angle or make it more acute to make it sharper

You can't lay on the beach and drink rum all day unless you start in the morning

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You can't lay on the beach and drink rum all day unless you start in the morning

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post #5 of 16

Luis, Your probably going to get a range of suggestions as there seems to be a few different schools of thought. When I'm happy with an OOTB edge I use it and then start maintenance with a 5K stone and work my way up. I find that I can go a very long ways before I have to think about using a coarser stone. If your not happy with the results working on the finer stones then go to plan B.

 

Dave

 

I think the most wonderful thing in the world is another chef. I'm always excited about learning new things about food.
Paul Prudhomme
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I think the most wonderful thing in the world is another chef. I'm always excited about learning new things about food.
Paul Prudhomme
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post #6 of 16
Thread Starter 

Hi guys...

 

This knife by no means needs a reprofiling or changing the angle, it's a super thin knife, one of those that we call "Lassers" and the profile itself is acute enough, it's more a matter of "polishing" the edge, it cuts perfectly but I can tell that the polishing OOTB is not very high. Is it just about hitting the 6000 stone directly?, or having to pass it thru the whole process of getting a burr on a 1200 grit stone and then go up as if I were starting with a dull knife ?. That's pretty much my dilemma, and one that I have never experienced before.

 

Let me know what you think! thumb.gif

 

Best regards.

Luis

post #7 of 16
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckFat View Post

Luis, Your probably going to get a range of suggestions as there seems to be a few different schools of thought. When I'm happy with an OOTB edge I use it and then start maintenance with a 5K stone and work my way up. I find that I can go a very long ways before I have to think about using a coarser stone. If your not happy with the results working on the finer stones then go to plan B.

 

Dave

 



Sounds like a great advice Dave, I'll give it a try! thumb.gif

Thanks.

Luis

post #8 of 16
You want it sharper, give it a few passes on a strop. Balsa wood works really well charged with a .25-.125 grit spray and will refine it nicely from OOTB. Of course there are many ways to strop

You can't lay on the beach and drink rum all day unless you start in the morning

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You can't lay on the beach and drink rum all day unless you start in the morning

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post #9 of 16
Thread Starter 

Thanks man!... An strop is something that I need to add to my wish list, I'll start doing some research on that matter.thumb.gif

post #10 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scubadoo97 View Post

You want it sharper, give it a few passes on a strop. Balsa wood works really well charged with a .25-.125 grit spray and will refine it nicely from OOTB. Of course there are many ways to strop

Now that's an interesting idea. How big are the strips of balsa you are using?

 

Dave

I think the most wonderful thing in the world is another chef. I'm always excited about learning new things about food.
Paul Prudhomme
Reply
I think the most wonderful thing in the world is another chef. I'm always excited about learning new things about food.
Paul Prudhomme
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post #11 of 16

I just purchased a few from Chefknivestogo which are 3" X 11"

 

Here is a video on their website

http://www.chefknivestogo.com/bamapa.html 

 

So far I've been pretty impressed.  I've been using a leather strop homemade with HandAmerican leather.  The balsa is suppose to not allow rolling of the edge which can  happen on softer material like leather.

You can't lay on the beach and drink rum all day unless you start in the morning

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You can't lay on the beach and drink rum all day unless you start in the morning

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post #12 of 16

Whoa...$38.95 for four ounces of Diamond spray ??? Holy cannolis have you considered ordering from Advanced abrasives? Their product is about $8 for the same amount but you will have to pick up a spray bottle at wally world for a buck or so if you don't already have one. If you buy eye glass cleaner in the small pump bottles you might want to try an empty one which is going to be my first shot.  Local hobby shops here are charging a few bucks for 3 x 24 strips of balsa. Interesting idea for sure. I'll leave a link but have to say I'm just getting ready to place my first order from AA so I can't give any first hand feed back just yet.

 

Dave

 

 

http://store.advancedabrasives.com/

 

I think the most wonderful thing in the world is another chef. I'm always excited about learning new things about food.
Paul Prudhomme
Reply
I think the most wonderful thing in the world is another chef. I'm always excited about learning new things about food.
Paul Prudhomme
Reply
post #13 of 16

Could also use "loaded paper"  (3-m micro) some of these are available with an adhesive backing and some not, but these put on a flat surface do essentially the same thing for a lot lower cost...

 

Cheers,

Chinacats 

 

 

http://www.japanwoodworker.com/dept.asp?s=JapanWoodworker&dept_id=13516

or

http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=33004&cat=1,43072

 

 

 

I haven't tried these, but they also look interesting and may be of value...

 

http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=68943&cat=1,43072


Edited by chinacats - 4/13/12 at 3:58pm
post #14 of 16

I have the same knife Luis, I bought it from CKtG back in December. Love it. Never used anything like it. It shaved my arm ootb.  When the edge needed some touch up, I got out my water stones and started touching up the edge. Began with a 1200 grit then to a polish with a 6000 grit.  I screwed it up. Started way too coarse, the knife didn't need that but I wanted to make it "better".   My freehand technique leaves a lot to be desired.

 

I decided to purchase the EdgePro Chosera set up from CKtG.  Fantastic system BTW.  I got the proper edge back on the Konosuke (270mm guyoto) finishing up with a couple of polishing strokes with the 10k stone (a little overkill I think but hey, that's why I bought the set).    It's right back to the factory edge, perhaps even a little sharper....hard to tell when a knife is so sharp.

 

Don't do what I did.  If you're very proficient with freehand sharpening, go for a few polishing passes and then a little stropping. I wouldn't start with anything coarser than a 5k chosera if all you're doing is giving it a few polishing strokes.  As the others have said in the above posts, you're at the polishing stage, not the sharpening stage.  Do you use a ceramic hone?  One or two passes on that wouldn't hurt after chopping a bushel on your cutting board.

 

Enjoy your new knife.

post #15 of 16
Dave, thanks for the AA link.

You can't lay on the beach and drink rum all day unless you start in the morning

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You can't lay on the beach and drink rum all day unless you start in the morning

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post #16 of 16
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish Boy View Post

I have the same knife Luis, I bought it from CKtG back in December. Love it. Never used anything like it. It shaved my arm ootb.  When the edge needed some touch up, I got out my water stones and started touching up the edge. Began with a 1200 grit then to a polish with a 6000 grit.  I screwed it up. Started way too coarse, the knife didn't need that but I wanted to make it "better".   My freehand technique leaves a lot to be desired.

 

I decided to purchase the EdgePro Chosera set up from CKtG.  Fantastic system BTW.  I got the proper edge back on the Konosuke (270mm guyoto) finishing up with a couple of polishing strokes with the 10k stone (a little overkill I think but hey, that's why I bought the set).    It's right back to the factory edge, perhaps even a little sharper....hard to tell when a knife is so sharp.

 

Don't do what I did.  If you're very proficient with freehand sharpening, go for a few polishing passes and then a little stropping. I wouldn't start with anything coarser than a 5k chosera if all you're doing is giving it a few polishing strokes.  As the others have said in the above posts, you're at the polishing stage, not the sharpening stage.  Do you use a ceramic hone?  One or two passes on that wouldn't hurt after chopping a bushel on your cutting board.

 

Enjoy your new knife.


Thanks man... That's what I'll do. Take it directly to the 6000 stone (Takenoko/Arashimaya). I wasn't sure if the 1200 was necessary, but now that you tell me your experience with the same knife, I have a better idea. thumb.gif

 

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