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Food - The Enemy - Page 2

post #31 of 48
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaneohegirlinaz View Post

Where we live now, food is as one said, strictly fuel, nothing fancy as they say `round these parts.  They seem to eat only because they HAVE to, not because they want to.  They seem to look upon food with disdain.  There are lots of folk that are what my BIL calls greys, people who's skin is an ashen color as a direct result of eating incorrectly.

 

I look at food as a celebration of life, we should eat well, enjoy it, share it, savor it, and as butzy stated, have a glass of wine with it too!  Back home in Hawaii, a meal was communal, not only in the eating, but also in the preparing of it as well.

(we're on a 'diet', I mean new way of looking at food, to adjust our attitudes towards food.  after moving to the mainland we went a little hog-wild on eating foods that we could not get back in Hawaii)

 

It's a shame that food is seen that way where you are. I agree with you, I see it as a celebration too. I actually look forward to going home, preparing and cooking a nice meal every night. It's the highlight of working week. I love sitting down to dinner with my husband and finding the time to talk properly about our day.

Good food is the foundation of genuine happiness

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Ravioli
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Good food is the foundation of genuine happiness

AUGUSTE ESCOFFIER

Ravioli
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post #32 of 48
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koukouvagia View Post

When people say things like "it's so simple" or "just eat less and move more" they are being ignorant. Obesity is a pervasive problem in our society and if you're willing to blame each individual for their lack of responsibility without taking into account the horrible state of food production then your are ill-informed. I wish it was as easy for some of us as it is for some of you. But while you are out celebrating your life with food there are others that need to slow down and say to themselves "food is not love." There are other yet who suffer disordered eating and eating disorders. I long for the simplicity of your life if you can so easily be 115 lbs. are you saying that I TOO can be 115 just by doing as you do? Where's the eye roll icon when I need it.

I agree when you say that it's not that easy. As someone who battled with body image and weight from the age of 13, I know it is FAR from easy. There are many reasons why people find comfort in food, and for some people it is not as easy as eating less or exercising. It is far more complex than that.

Good food is the foundation of genuine happiness

AUGUSTE ESCOFFIER

Ravioli
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Good food is the foundation of genuine happiness

AUGUSTE ESCOFFIER

Ravioli
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post #33 of 48

Interesting thread,,,,,,

 

Diets are considered something that's temporary..,,,.in that there's an end in sight.....a weight goal.

Now what???

I maintain that there is no such thing as a diet.

In order to lose weight and keep it off......forever.......one has to make some basic lifestyle changes in order to make this happen.

 

 

KK....fat people are not lazy undisciplined slobs..............There are all sorts of reasons for overeating and to put a label and group everybody into that label is just wrong.

 

According to the BMI scale (which I still to this day don't understand) I am considered obese at 185 # on a 5' 7" frame.

I wear a size 34 waist, and I don't have a belly overhang, yet I'm still labeled obese.....

I walk my dogs 3 miles in the morning and another 1 1/2 in the evening. I left weights and do a cardio workout 3-4 times a week.

 

Now, I'm not tooting my horn because I can fall off this wall so easily and be right back at square 1.

This is something that takes time to develop and doesn't happen overnight.

post #34 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pollopicu View Post

 

I'm honestly kinda tired of hearing about "eating disorders" and using that as an excuse.. I'm not saying you KK, really I am not, because I have no idea who you are, I just mean in general. What does food disorder mean? that people love food and can't stop eating it? well I love food too! obviously If I'm in the food business, and would love to sit on the couch eating crap all day, or stroll music festivals eating fried treats, and ice cream, but my common sense tells me I shouldn't do that if I don't want to gain too much weight and become obese and unhealthy. A lack of discipline does not a food addict make.

 

It pains me to walk away from my favorite foods sometimes, but it's either that, or I can cry later and begin labeling myself as obese with a food disorder because it's much easier that way. You can't have it all, not unless you change the kinds of foods you eat, and how they are prepared. People don't become fat with fresh healthy intelligently prepared meats, and produce. Not unless they have a severe diagnosed thyroid problem, which is not what we're discussing here.

 

 

I think there's a misconception that people who watch what they eat don't sometimes suffer for their choices, and people who are obese with "FD" don't give credit that some of us are disciplined enough to resist temptation.

 

I often notice people who have weight issues get rather defensive about this topic because they are more interested in being a sophist on the topic than looking at the facts that are as clear as day and really try to help themselves. They are usually more interested in making excuses and self-diagnosing themselves with "disorders" than making a true and honest commitment in correcting these issues.

 

You may not have used the words "fat lazy slob" but from what you wrote here I gather that you think it's as simple as resisting temptations.  I do not consider myself any kind of "sophist" since I put my own words into practice and work very hard to maintain a healthy lifestyle.  But ChrisBelgium is right on the money about exercise not causing a lot of weightloss.  Exercise is fantastic for many reasons, but losing weight happens with moderating food. Being healthy is not a choice, it is about making several choices on a daily basis.  I would say you're being a little more idealistic than I am being a sophist.  There are many factors that have contributed to obesity, I've brought up several about schools, fast food, cost of food etc,.  Yes, it is simple - eat less, move more if you are able to do that, if you can afford to do that.  But obviously there is something bigger going on here than just bad choices in order for the American obesity rates to have sky rocketed.  Personal responsibility, yes it plays a role.  But without education, and a pervasiveness of sugar and salt in cheap foods will and has resulted in an epidemic.  I imagine that for a single mother with 2 kids and 2 jobs would find it difficult to fit exercise into her day and cook "healthy intelligently prepared meats," whatever that means.  Sometimes the more economical choice is a big bag of white bread, pre-sliced meat and processed cheese.  Or a visit to the value menu.  These choices are being made every day.  It'd be nice if everyone knew better but sometimes they don't, and sometimes they do know better but opt for the easier choice or the cheaper choice.  There's all kinds of factors to consider before judging someone for their choices.

 

I struggle to understand how someone identifies an eating disorder as "people love food and can't stop eating it?"  There are several types of eating disorders that are extremely difficult to treat and can lead to deadly consequences.  Nobody wants or likes to have an eating disorder, it is not something that people invent so that they have an excuse to eat as much or as little as they want.  In fact most people would trade their right arm to have a treatable thyroid problem instead of an eating disorder.

 

I'm in no position to judge how and how much you struggle with your food choices.  

"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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post #35 of 48

There are a few things that were posted I simply don't agree with, like the statement that "exercise not causing a lot of weight-loss". That boggles my mind. I'm sitting here speechless about that, but I am going to graciously bow out of this discussion because we were all given a warning by Pete.

 

 

All i'm going to say is that I respect everyone here I've discussed this topic with.

“After a good dinner one can forgive anybody, even one's own relations.”
Oscar Wilde

 

 

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“After a good dinner one can forgive anybody, even one's own relations.”
Oscar Wilde

 

 

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post #36 of 48

Like I said, exercise is great.  It burns calories, but it doesn't burn that many calories.  If you eat a piece of cake that's 500cal conservatively, how much exercise do you think is necessary to burn it off?  Looking strictly at numbers exercise alone does not make up for a poor diet.  It is very important to me to exercise, but I do not rely on it solely for keeping me healthy.  I have a quote (one of many) on my refrigerator that says "Weight loss is done in the kitchen, fitness is done in your sneakers."

"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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post #37 of 48
Quote:

Originally Posted by Koukouvagia View Post

 

There are many factors that have contributed to obesity, I've brought up several about schools, fast food, cost of food etc,.  Yes, it is simple - eat less, move more if you are able to do that, if you can afford to do that.  But obviously there is something bigger going on here than just bad choices in order for the American obesity rates to have sky rocketed.  Personal responsibility, yes it plays a role.  But without education, and a pervasiveness of sugar and salt in cheap foods will and has resulted in an epidemic.  I imagine that for a single mother with 2 kids and 2 jobs would find it difficult to fit exercise into her day and cook "healthy intelligently prepared meats," whatever that means.  Sometimes the more economical choice is a big bag of white bread, pre-sliced meat and processed cheese.  Or a visit to the value menu.  These choices are being made every day.  It'd be nice if everyone knew better but sometimes they don't, and sometimes they do know better but opt for the easier choice or the cheaper choice.  There's all kinds of factors to consider before judging someone for their choices.

 

Judging anyone else for their choices has proven to me time after time to be a pointless dead end road. I wholeheartedly agree that education and enlightenment are answers that bear nourishing fruit. I can't answer for anyone else, but I take it upon myself to initiate my own learning process.

 

That learning process has shown to me that I can put food on my table, that goes in the dietary direction that i choose for myself, quickly, inexpensively, and that is full of flavor.

 

“Moderation in all things, especially moderation.”
Ralph Waldo Emerson

 

Moderation has never been my strong point. In fact it is an ongoing battle, but one that I make progress on by focusing on balance. Balance is essential for me. Balance in considering all the dietary, financial, and ease of preparation matters, when shopping at the grocery store or farmers market (cheapest and easiest, isn't all ways best, crap in / crap out). When I employ balance in my diet, I don't have to struggle with considering what not to eat. No wasted time sweating bad juju.

 

I had a treatable thyroid condition. Thyroid cancer. 30 years later, I still have my right arm and my life. Balance. My mantra.

Wisdom comes with age, but sometimes age comes alone.
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Wisdom comes with age, but sometimes age comes alone.
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post #38 of 48

Eat some of everything and nothing to excess. My grandmother taught me that one. She doesn't know that she did, but she did. She taught me much. She bought a new car when she was 93.

Wisdom comes with age, but sometimes age comes alone.
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Wisdom comes with age, but sometimes age comes alone.
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post #39 of 48
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheflayne View Post

Eat some of everything and nothing to excess. My grandmother taught me that one. She doesn't know that she did, but she did. She taught me much. She bought a new car when she was 93.

 

What a lady biggrin.gif  She sounds great.

Good food is the foundation of genuine happiness

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Ravioli
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Good food is the foundation of genuine happiness

AUGUSTE ESCOFFIER

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post #40 of 48
Perhaps a little OT but as my friend always says wothehell....
I sat and watched an osprey today as he swooped down picked up a fish and flew away....it was joyous as it always is to watch that.
Then i thought WOW!.... how easy breezy life would be to have such clear and simple food choices

joey cool.gifwink.gif
Edited by durangojo - 7/11/13 at 10:46pm

food is like love...it should be entered into with abandon or not at all        Harriet Van Horne

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food is like love...it should be entered into with abandon or not at all        Harriet Van Horne

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post #41 of 48
Hormones make you fat. It is impossible to ignore them 100% of the time. And you can do a LOT of damage with just a few slip-ups. If you have high insulin, (you Dr. will tell you that you are not diabetic, but you sure aren't normal) - anyway high insulin tells your body to store fat above all else. (just as low insulin causes your body to give up fat stores.)

Our American perverted diet with hormone fed meat animals, unlabeled GMOs and other chemicals on our food causes these imbalances. After you figure this out, it is still a question of money in most cases, whether you can afford pure (r) food or not. Often what you need isn't even available.

But what almost anyone can do is limit meat products to an absolute minimum. Eat fibrous veggies, and venture out, avoiding the "big" cash crop foods, and going for things not so popular that Monsanto has poison-ized them yet. I've found I actually like dandelion greens broccoli rabe, and even pokeweed.(Don't try this unless someone experienced shows you how to cook it, it is toxic if not prepared correctly).

As for grains, eat millet, rye, and such rather than wheat, , corn, rice, oats etc. I've even seen reports that they're modifying quinoa now that it is gaining acceptance.
post #42 of 48
Thanks Indy, I think that to be true as well.

"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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post #43 of 48

I love eating food that's one of my favorite things to do. i allso jug 4 time a week anywhere between 3 t0 5 miles so i dot think that you have to give up eating food you love just to stay in shape.

post #44 of 48

Here's an interesting article that was featured on Georgia Public Radio just the other day.  It concerns the area of evolutionary biology and will give you all something to think about.

Best and I'm a foodie.   I know very little but the little that I know I want to know very well.

 

-T

Brot und Wein
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Best and I'm a foodie.   I know very little but the little that I know I want to know very well.

 

-T

Brot und Wein
(1 photos)
 
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post #45 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by siduri View Post
 

Yes, it's true.  What particularly disturbs me, though, is people feeling "guilty" for eating something.  Unless you've stolen it from a starving person, i see no sense in this guilt.  If you wanted to lose weight, you could feel, i don't know, stupid, annoyed with yourself, perhaps, but guilt?  For me guilt is reserved for hurting someone. 

 

This didn't strike out at me at first but it does now.  I agree that guilt can derail someone and it's difficult to understand if you've never felt guilt over eating something, but I'll try to briefly explain what role guilt plays.  You say that guilt is reserved for hurting someone, I rarely hurt anyone that I know of so I can't comment on that.  But feeling guilt over eating something is over hurting oneself.  I will start to feel guilty if I eat pasta 2-3 days in a row, I could eat pasta every day to tell you the truth.  I start to feel guilty because I I feel shame, that I'm overindulging.  There's nothing wrong with indulging oneself, but overindulgence is criminal.  It's not bacchanalia every day.  We only have one body, we are obliged to take of it, and then it will take care of us.  

 

Once you're used to being healthy and eating healthy foods then you can start to appreciate the power of food in your body.  If I eat bread and wheat for a couple of days I really start to feel weighed down.  In times of stress I reach for those comfort foods.  Then I snap out of it and get back on track, I immediately feel better when I eat more raw foods, simply prepared foods and lots of fresh fruits and vegetables, and less heavy foods.

"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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post #46 of 48

Still, Koukouovagia, i think that guilt about pleasure is an old story and is culturally induced. Pleasure is bad.  

I can say that if i overeat, i feel stupid, why did i do that, and bla, how crappy i feel now, or afraid of the long term consequences. 

 

Would you feel guilty if you skied too long or ran too much or something and got a sprain or injur?, you might feel stupid or annoyed with yourself for not knowing your limit, but guilt?  And yet you would have hurt yourself.  .  

"Siduri said, 'Gilgamesh, where are you roaming? You will never find the eternal life that you seek...Savour your food, make each of your days a delight, ... let music and dancing fill your house, love the child who holds you by the hand and give your wife pleasure in your embrace.'"
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"Siduri said, 'Gilgamesh, where are you roaming? You will never find the eternal life that you seek...Savour your food, make each of your days a delight, ... let music and dancing fill your house, love the child who holds you by the hand and give your wife pleasure in your embrace.'"
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post #47 of 48

Guilt over pleasure is a completely separate thing Siduri.  I don't feel such thing over pleasure, I think that stems from America's puritanical beginnings.  I wasn't born/raised here and I don't feel guilt about going out on a weeknight, or having a glass of wine at lunchtime like so many people I know do.  Getting physically hurt is completely different because it's an accident.  Of course I wouldn't feel guilty if I sprained my ankle while skiing.  In fact I'd rather sprain my ankle skiing than not sprain my ankle sitting on a couch.  But guilt over food?  It's there, and I don't think I can explain it properly.  Unless you've battled addiction, being overweight , unless you've suffered from an eating disorder, body image issues, or discrimination based on weight then I can imagine it would be extremely difficult to understand the guilt associated with addiction altogether.  And pleasure associated with food is questionable, because it is assumed the more the better.  Well, it's not true for me and though my brain understands that a bowl of pasta is much more enjoyable if I have it sparingly, my cravings don't understand that.  So I was at Mario and Lidia's market eatery "Eataly" the other day and had a plate of pasta with sugo di mare and it was fabulous.  But I really can't have enough of that stuff and it immediately steers me into having pasta the next day too!  I have to fight that urge every single time I have simple carbs like that.  Once in a while we go to a local brunch place that makes the most amazing blueberry pancakes and I indulge without guilt!  And then for a couple of days I have to work hard to reign in my cravings for more sweets and baked goods.   That's where the guilt comes in, because most of the time I'm pretty good about getting back on track but there are sometimes when it's a slippery slope and I spend the next few days eating chocolate chip muffins lol.  It's gotten a lot easier now that I'm older and a mother and thinking about my health very seriously but when I was younger and didn't care about that sort of thing I didn't care about what I ate.  

 

Then of course you have the people who really don't understand how difficult it is for some of us and are food pushers.  You don't say to an alcoholic "oh come on, one little drink won't hurt you" or to a drug addict "just take a little pain medication for that!" because their goal is to abstain abstain abstain and everyone accepts it.  Anorexia and bulemia are accepted as food disorders but compulsive eaters, food addicts or whatever you want to call themget a bad rap because #1 people think they're just making up their food disorder just so they can eat a lot, many think that it's an excuse to be a fat lazy slob, or an excuse to indulge in weakness.  They're also have to hear stupid things like "have just a little, it won't kill you!" or get upset when you refuse a slice of their homemade apple pie.  Anyway, like I said it's very difficult to explain when so many people don't really believe that these types of compulsions exist.

 

I don't doubt for a second that there are people out there who can eat what they want and run a few miles a week and maintain their weight.  But for them to actually believe that everyone can be like that is weird.  Without taking into account genetics, environment, education, culture, stress/anxiety, and psychological pre-dispositions it's absurd to have a one-size-fits all method of well-being or weight maintenance.  I'm not willing to pass judgment on how difficult that must be for you, and I don't think it's fair for anyone to compare their difficulties with the difficulties of others.  Plain as day I can see that some people can go days without eating if they're feeling a lot of stress over something (like a divorce etc).  It's totally obvious that that happens, of course I cannot wrap my mind around it because in times of stress I reach for food, but I cannot ignore the reality that other people deal with food in a different manner.  What point is there to argue against the validity of their actions?


Edited by Koukouvagia - 10/9/13 at 6:35am

"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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post #48 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by kokopuffs View Post
 

Here's an interesting article that was featured on Georgia Public Radio just the other day.  It concerns the area of evolutionary biology and will give you all something to think about.

 

 

Really interesting listening to that, thank you!  And he really explained very well what is wrong with paleo diets, I myself lean towards paleo but not in a strict way and I allow legumes, dairy and some grains.

"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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