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Invertase help

post #1 of 16
Thread Starter 

Hi

I want to make some chocolates (I haven't done molded chocolates in about 25 years!). I can't find my recipes for filling them and so thought I would use fondant. I bought a lb package of the Wilton rolled fondant, and need to make it "creamy". I remember that you can use Invertase to "liquefy" it to a creamy consistency but don't know the procedure or how much invertase to use. Any help would be appreciated.(Then I have to find a source for the invertase)

post #2 of 16

http://www.pastrychef.com/INVERTASE_p_1560.html

post #3 of 16
Thread Starter 

Thank you so much Brian :)

Have a very Merry Christmas :)

post #4 of 16

The fondant that comes in the wilton package is different then the fondant used for centers, like a peppermint patty or cherry cordial, they sometimes contain gelatin or other sabilizers to make it suitable for rolling onto a cake. Confectionery fondant acts a little bit differently, but I am curious to what degree the invertase will liquify the rolled fondant. After you make the bonbon, give them a good week and a half or two weeks for the invertase to do its thing, let us know how liquid the centers become.

post #5 of 16
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minas6907 View Post
 

The fondant that comes in the wilton package is different then the fondant used for centers, like a peppermint patty or cherry cordial, they sometimes contain gelatin or other sabilizers to make it suitable for rolling onto a cake. Confectionery fondant acts a little bit differently, but I am curious to what degree the invertase will liquify the rolled fondant. After you make the bonbon, give them a good week and a half or two weeks for the invertase to do its thing, let us know how liquid the centers become.

Will do :) I am still waiting for the invertase. They have the shipping date as January 6th - probably because of the holidays.

 

I don't want a "liquid" filling, more like a creamy filling, but the Wilton fondant is too "stiff" as it is. It has been over 20 years since I made molded chocolates and I cannot locate any of the recipes I used to use for the fillings. I used to have a great peppermint creamy filling recipe, but cannot find any of the recipes I used to use. I have searched the internet for recipes and haven't found much. I have the "Making Artisan Chocolates" author Andrew Garrison Shotts" but they are mostly ganache recipes for the molded chocolates.

post #6 of 16

I was thinking Andrew Shotts had a fondant recipe in his book...perhaps not. Heres one I use, It works perfectly, its from Chocolates and Confections. Bring 1000g sugar, 200g glucose, and 200g water to a boil. Keep the sided of your pan clean from sugar granules. Boil to 117c. Pour this mixture on a stone slab, and allow to cool undisturbed, cool until it reaches 50c. Agitate with a scraper on the slab until the entire mass crystallizes, about 15 min or so. Store in an air tight container.

 

The invertase wont make it an absolute liquid, but it will turn it into the consistency of a thick fluid, I guess we all have different ways of describing it.

post #7 of 16
Thread Starter 

Thanks Minas.

At Amazon I have a book on my "Wish List" - Chocolate, Chocolate, Chocolate -  Jean-Pierre Wybauw and Frank Croes - are you familiar with it? I am considering buying it.

post #8 of 16

Hi Sylvia. I am not familiar with that book, although I too had it on my wish list, given the low price and well known author. I did decide against it, after reviewing the table of contents and index, I felt I already had good books on hand. Personally, I do feel that Chocolates and Confections by Peter Greweling and Art of the Chocolatier by Ewald Notter are a bit more in depth. Notters book covers everything about chocolate, as does Grewelings, but Chocolates and Confections goes quite a bit into sugar work, where as Art of Chocolatier just touches it. Let me know what you think if you get Wybauw's book.

post #9 of 16
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minas6907 View Post
 

Hi Sylvia. I am not familiar with that book, although I too had it on my wish list, given the low price and well known author. I did decide against it, after reviewing the table of contents and index, I felt I already had good books on hand. Personally, I do feel that Chocolates and Confections by Peter Greweling and Art of the Chocolatier by Ewald Notter are a bit more in depth. Notters book covers everything about chocolate, as does Grewelings, but Chocolates and Confections goes quite a bit into sugar work, where as Art of Chocolatier just touches it. Let me know what you think if you get Wybauw's book.

Thanks Minas - I was hoping there would be recipes for more centers. I have the "Making Artisan Chocolates" book, but all the recipes for molded chocolates are for ganache fillings. Until the other day I hadn't made molded chocolates since my kids were teenagers (youngest is now 39) and I remember making a peppermint cream filling and a coffee cream filling (coffee creams were always my favourites when I bought boxes of chocolates.) I have no idea where I got the recipes from.

post #10 of 16

Can I get in on this for a few comments?

I think I am progressing with my hand dipped cherry cordials but correct whatever sounds idiotic.

The hubs loves CCC.

Asked a friend about the process and he pointed me in the direction of Peter Greweling's CIA course book.

After a mixup with Amazon (bought the home version) and the Grands blatant disregard of my Christmas wish list I finally found the student copy at half price books (altho there was nothing half priced about it  :eek: .

This dog was pretty tired of hunting when it was finished with the hunting and gathering and prepping.

Used pure cane sugar for the fondant and somewhere I had seen the tip to the beautiful red liquor that pours out when the chocolate is breeched is....some of the cherry cordial, added to the fondant along with the intervase (this would prove to be an accomplice in my undoing).

I had splurged on the liquor (glad it comes in a tiny bottle lol) and macerated a jar of organic cherries (stems on) for 3 weeks and was chomping at the bit to get started.

South Texas had day after day of humid (but cold brrr) weather.

One day dawned cold and dry so I thought to myself...."self..today is the day" and told everyone if they bothered me they had to clean up after me (another story ).

Cherry tinted fondant got the intervase added.....cherries drained and dried on paper towels....chocolate tempered and kept warm on my kitchen heating pad (great for rising bread...just FYI) and the assembly commenced.

Right away I noticed the fondant to be a bit tacky so kneaded in a bit of 10X.

Cherry, fondant, dry and dip....set on parchment (had learned my lesson last year so had made little chocolate dot bases to set the candy on ...no leakage for me!)

Made ALOT of candy.

There was sugar and chocolate and fondant and juice all over the kitchen (this is why the threat works so well, lol) but the cordials were so pretty with the stems still attached, (just like the pix on the internet) covered and stored in a cool dry place and marked the calender for 10 days.

Ten days later, with no one at home to witness the unveil I placed a few on a cutting board and got my trusty and very sharp fillet knife out.

Cut into 3...the chocolate shell was crisp with a beautiful SNAP.

OMG is that bloody pus pouring from my candy?

I was sick.

All I can figure out is the starch in the 10X had not been affected by the intervase, stayed white and thickish and defiantly not something those with weak stomachs (not me I was a labor and delivery nurse, lol) to be gifted.

The leftovers are still in the fridge if anyone is interested  ..makes a great add in for french vanilla ice cream.

:rolleyes:

 

Me?

I drank the leftover cordial juice and cleaned the kitchen.

:beer:

 

Can hardly wait until next year.

 

mimi

post #11 of 16
Flipflopgirl, I'm sort of having a hard time following. What was so horrible about the fondant? So it had not liquified completely? As stupid as it sounds, I'm having a hard time imagining the 'pus' you describe. As for the fondant, you wouldnt want to knead any confectioners sugar into it. Which book by Greweling were you using? It sounds like the standard textbook right, not the 'at home' edition? When making the cherry cordials, you would first make your fondant. Then to make the cherry cordials, You'd heat up the fondant to 165f, dip the cherrys, set on the chocolate disks and leave to crystallize. Then dip the pieces whole. From your description, it doesnt sound like you heated up the fondant and dipped. Did you do this? What messing with me is when you say you kneaded confectioners sugar into the fondant. Were you using grewelings recipe for fondant, or was this pre-purchasd? How did you combine the fondant and cherrys?
post #12 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minas6907 View Post

Flipflopgirl, I'm sort of having a hard time following. What was so horrible about the fondant? So it had not liquified completely? As stupid as it sounds, I'm having a hard time imagining the 'pus' you describe. As for the fondant, you wouldnt want to knead any confectioners sugar into it. Which book by Greweling were you using? It sounds like the standard textbook right, not the 'at home' edition? When making the cherry cordials, you would first make your fondant. Then to make the cherry cordials, You'd heat up the fondant to 165f, dip the cherrys, set on the chocolate disks and leave to crystallize. Then dip the pieces whole. From your description, it doesnt sound like you heated up the fondant and dipped. Did you do this? What messing with me is when you say you kneaded confectioners sugar into the fondant. Were you using grewelings recipe for fondant, or was this pre-purchasd? How did you combine the fondant and cherrys?

 

Sorry Minas sometimes I ramble .

I am a newbie to the world of hand dipped chocolates and only just started my cherry cordial journey last year.

The recipe I used was borrowed from a collegue in the baking world as the CB did not make it into my possession until after the holidays.

I was given three choices for the fondant component......

Liquid (to dip), powdered (roll the damp fruit in the cane sugar and spray with intervase spiked juice then roll again...sounds way too messy) and solid (which is fondant dough).

All were based on pure cane sugar.

I used the dough method and this is where I made the huge mistake.

The dough was a bit wet and in my little world if the fondant is tacky you simply knead in a bit of 10x and let it rest then proceed to roll and cover the cake.

Well candy fondant and cake fondant are two different creatures.

This is now burned in my brain....as are all the other mistakes I have made while skipping merrily along life's path.

I am rambling sorry.

I took a small piece of the pinkish dough and "ironed" it in the palm of my hand and then wrapped the cherry and placed to the side to dry before dipping.

The rest is in the body of my post but yes the delicious (altho infected appearing) liquid was an opaque pink.

Not right at all.

 

mimi

 

Thanks for the interest, Minas.

Other than following the recipe in my new (used) Greweling text are there any other tips or comments that might help when I again attempt to enclose drunken fruit in chocolate?

At this point in the year I am busy with preparations for the PITA of a holiday that is Valentine's Day.

Heart cookies of all shapes and sizes covered in a yummy (rolled) fondant tinted in all manner of shades of red and pink.

Tiny cakes covered in (poured) fondant (left white so the hand piped decos pop) and sometimes dusted with silver sometimes not.

No plans for candy fondant at this point but if plans change you can be sure that it will be left unadulterated !

 

m.

post #13 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by flipflopgirl View Post
 

 

Sorry Minas sometimes I ramble .

I am a newbie to the world of hand dipped chocolates and only just started my cherry cordial journey last year.

The recipe I used was borrowed from a collegue in the baking world as the CB did not make it into my possession until after the holidays.

I was given three choices for the fondant component......

Liquid (to dip), powdered (roll the damp fruit in the cane sugar and spray with intervase spiked juice then roll again...sounds way too messy) and solid (which is fondant dough).

All were based on pure cane sugar.

I used the dough method and this is where I made the huge mistake.

The dough was a bit wet and in my little world if the fondant is tacky you simply knead in a bit of 10x and let it rest then proceed to roll and cover the cake.

Well candy fondant and cake fondant are two different creatures.

This is now burned in my brain....as are all the other mistakes I have made while skipping merrily along life's path.

I am rambling sorry.

I took a small piece of the pinkish dough and "ironed" it in the palm of my hand and then wrapped the cherry and placed to the side to dry before dipping.

The rest is in the body of my post but yes the delicious (altho infected appearing) liquid was an opaque pink.

Not right at all.

 

mimi

 

Thanks for the interest, Minas.

Other than following the recipe in my new (used) Greweling text are there any other tips or comments that might help when I again attempt to enclose drunken fruit in chocolate?

At this point in the year I am busy with preparations for the PITA of a holiday that is Valentine's Day.

Heart cookies of all shapes and sizes covered in a yummy (rolled) fondant tinted in all manner of shades of red and pink.

Tiny cakes covered in (poured) fondant (left white so the hand piped decos pop) and sometimes dusted with silver sometimes not.

No plans for candy fondant at this point but if plans change you can be sure that it will be left unadulterated !

 

m.


I apologize for the late reply. Thats funny, I've never seen the final outcome of a cordial that has been wrapped in the cake fondant, but doesnt sound too great! Yes, your totally right, cake fondant and confectionery fondant are two different beasts with two different lists of ingredients. My only advice is to read up all you can, everything in chocolates and confections about the cordials and making fondant, most notably the temps at which you wait for fondant to cool before agitating (120f) and the temp at which you heat up the fondant before proceeding with the dipping (165f. Exceeding this temp will damage the invertase that is added to the fondant). You will get the hang of it, and it actually becomes quite easy. If you dont have a marble or granite surface to agitate the fondant on, you can use a mixer. You do absolutly want to wait until it cools down to 120f before turning on the mixer. Once it cools to 120f, turn your mixer on with a paddle on low and wait about 15 min before the mixture fully crystallizes. But do read everything pertaining to the subject, you'll get it down!

post #14 of 16

I guess I am not expressing myself correctly in regards to the form of fondant I used.

It is the candy fondant suggested for making chocolate dipped creams.

Like peppermint or other flavored centers.

Made with 100% cane sugar and water brought to temp over heat and then either whizzed in processor or worked by hand on a marble slab until cold and opaque and stiff.

The recipe I borrowed gave the option to leave it solid and use a tiny bit, ironed in my palm, to enclose the cherries.

I had wrapped and stored this component in the fridge for a week or so.

When removed from fridge the candy "dough" felt sticky.

From hindsight reading I now know this is normal as it is meant to be melted and kept at a low temp for dipping.

Being the first time for me and having only worked with rolled and poured fondant I drew from my experience with the rolled and kneaded some 10X into it.

Yes it corrected the problem at hand but the long term consequences caught me by surprise.

The (cane) sugar melted but the 10X did not.

Results described above were a shock....but I did learn a lesson.

Thanks, Minas for your time and valuable input.

 

mimi

 

Thought to mention this...I am not much of a reader learner.

Yes I CAN read just one of those people that do better with a demo.

Did not stop/slow me at all in earning a BSN nor many many certificates in medicine.

See one do one teach one.

Works for me.

:look:

 

m.

post #15 of 16
Just found this thread. I have been making cherries for 20 years. I tried the powder sugar base this year for first time. It's not juicing up yet.
Flip flop, refrigeration slows down invertaise. It can take 2-4 week. Put them in an Air tight container and hide in the pantry til Xmas. You have to make them in October to be ready for Xmas.
post #16 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merrycherries View Post

Just found this thread. I have been making cherries for 20 years. I tried the powder sugar base this year for first time. It's not juicing up yet.
Flip flop, refrigeration slows down invertaise. It can take 2-4 week. Put them in an Air tight container and hide in the pantry til Xmas. You have to make them in October to be ready for Xmas.

 

OMG what a fiasco of a trip that was (and an expensive learning experience without the learning part lol) and was kinda fun to revisit.

Thanks for the advice it makes perfect sense (now) :o

The Grands are wanting to do the cherries for Valentine's gifts.

Never ever will I pull another recipe from Pinterest on the advise of a distant "friend" lol.

Welcome to Chef talk!

 

mimi

 

Edit... I have since learned to control/edit the rambling (mostly) and try to get right to the point.

Sometimes I hear it sounds short and rude so still looking for the happy medium.

:)

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