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Which Flour to use for Carrot-Apple Cake?

post #1 of 24
Thread Starter 

Hi there wise bakers,

 

Please do advise me. I would like to bake a birthday cake for my son who's turning one year old.

I found this recipe online of a Carrot-Apple Cake without any sugar. The recipe can be found here: http://homemade-baby-food-recipes.com/healthy-first-birthday-cake-recipes-sugar-free/

 

Now, the recipe calls for 2 CUPS OF WHOLE WHEAT FLOUR and it also calls for 1tsp of baking powder and 1tsp of baking soda. However, I only have WHOLE WHEAT BREAD FLOUR or SELF RISING WHOLE WHEAT FLOUR. 

 

My questions is: WHICH FLOUR TO USE?

 

Will the bread flour not be too heavy for a cake? 

 

But when I opt for the self-rising whole wheat flour, would I still need to use the baking powder and baking soda?? If yes, in what quantities?

 

Please enlighten me as I am a terrible baker and would really like to ensure that this birthday cake is not another epic failure :-)

 

Many thanks,

Vlerk

post #2 of 24

Use the self rising whole wheat bread flour.  Use a scant 2 cups and cut the baking soda and baking powder in half.

 

Or just use the regular bread flour but 2 scant cups.

 

That is all I can do without actually knowing how much soda and powder there is in your flour.

post #3 of 24
Thread Starter 


Thank you Kuan! So the bread flour is also fine to use, right? Is there a difference between whole wheat flour and whole wheat BREAD flour?

Curious, as I am new to baking. 

post #4 of 24

I looked at several references and found that self rising flour can have anywhere between 1/2tsp to 1 1/2tsp of baking powder per cup.

(I personally do not purchase self rising flour because it is impossible to know how much leavening is in it and hard to convert as you are finding out)

 

I would suggest you tone down your bread flour instead and use the leavening as suggested.

the best way to do this is measure 2 cups of flour take out 1/4 cup of flour out and add 1/4 cup of cornstarch

 

(since you lack experience follow these instructions to measure: use a level 1 cup container, scoop your flour in excess of the cup, do not pat down to compact then scrap the flour level to the cup with a knife or straight edge implement. Do the same using a 1/4 cup container.

http://www.thelittlekitchen.net/how-to-measure-flour/

in the event you only have a graduated measuring cup then add flour using a spoon and level gently to the 2 cup amount, then proceed to take out 1/4 cup in a similar fashion and add 1/4 cup of cornstarch likewise)

 

additionally, as a moonlighting nutritionist ahem!, I hope you understand that the recipe you are making should be called No sugar added Carrot Cake rather than Sugar-free. Since there is free sugar in No sugar added (sugar-free) applesauce, raisins, carrots and to some extent flour.

 

Probably in the end this cake has less sugar than a traditional one though.

 

Luc H.

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post #5 of 24
Thread Starter 


Thanks for the advice Luc! That is a good tip. I do not have corn starch at hand, could I use all-purpose flour instead?

post #6 of 24

All purpose flour won't reduce the protein that much... I would suggest you go 1 cup AP and 1 cup Whole wheat bread.

Luc H.

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post #7 of 24

This recipe will produce a pretty dense cake due to the nature of the ingredients added (banana, applesauce, higher protein flour) as well as those not added ( sugar and oil are tenderizers) so don't think it is anything you did wrong.

 

I noticed the instructions say to stir thoroughly but I give you permission to sift or wisk the drys together then dump them in and use a sort of folding technique to mix and stop when almost all the flour mixture is incorporated.

Don't worry if you still see a few streaks of flour as it will be absorbed during baking.

 

Why fold instead of stir?

The more you work your (wet) flour the more you develop the gluten (and the tougher your cake will be).

 

mimi

post #8 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlerk76 View Post
 


Thanks for the advice Luc! That is a good tip. I do not have corn starch at hand, could I use all-purpose flour instead?

 

This is a great sub!

Lessens the chance of a tough cake even more!

 

mimi

post #9 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by flipflopgirl View Post
 

 

This is a great sub!

Lessens the chance of a tough cake even more!

 

mimi

That's what I was going for...

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by flipflopgirl View Post
 

This recipe will produce a pretty dense cake due to the nature of the ingredients added (banana, applesauce, higher protein flour) as well as those not added ( sugar and oil are tenderizers) so don't think it is anything you did wrong.

 

I noticed the instructions say to stir thoroughly but I give you permission to sift or wisk the drys together then dump them in and use a sort of folding technique to mix and stop when almost all the flour mixture is incorporated.

Don't worry if you still see a few streaks of flour as it will be absorbed during baking.

 

Why fold instead of stir?

The more you work your (wet) flour the more you develop the gluten (and the tougher your cake will be).

 

mimi

 

for that reason.

 

Thanks Mimi for clarifying that! and great tip.

Luc H.

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post #10 of 24

I have been cruising through this thread. It points out some very important facts about flours.

I just wanted to add that adding corn starch to a hard wheat flour, white or whole, will reduce the amount of protein in the flour. It really won't soften the hard wheat.

Unless it's large volume, It will usually result in the same outcome as using just the hard flour.  Maybe less tight from the reduced gluten but really not softer.

The dilution of the hard grain flour will  not change the type of the hard starch granules and probably won't absorb more moisture.

Just what I've always understood, making any sense?

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post #11 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by panini View Post
 

The dilution of the hard grain flour will  not change the type of the hard starch granules and probably won't absorb more moisture.

Just what I've always understood, making any sense?

Yes true assuming that the whole wheat bread flour in question here is actually from hard wheat, in itself, a very specialized ingredient.  Typically we are talking about commercial whole wheat bread flour which is a combination of all purpose flour, added gluten and wheat bran.

Commercial "whole wheat" flour actually is missing the germ.  The reason is because wheat germ is unstable which makes it turn rancid very quickly (before the consumer buys it).

 

At home, I never buy whole wheat flour.  When a recipe requires it, I combine AP flour with wheat bran and germ (and gluten if for making a bread).

 

In any event, I doubt that there will be a big difference in this recipe.

 

Luc H.

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post #12 of 24
Thread Starter 
If I use 1 cup whole wheat bread flour (strong) and 1 cup All purpose flour, instead of 2 cups whole wheat flour would I need to adjust the amount of baking powder and baking soda?

Recipe calls for 1 tsp of both.

Many thanks for all the advice!
post #13 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlerk76 View Post

If I use 1 cup whole wheat bread flour (strong) and 1 cup All purpose flour, instead of 2 cups whole wheat flour

That is your only substitution, the rest of the recipe remains the same.

I personally would've preferred the cornstarch sub to lighten the cake.

 

as @flipflopgirl pointed out, the recipe you're going for is quite dense to start and this substitution will not necessary help at making it lighter so heed her instructions above

 

If your bread flour specifically claims to be hard wheat (if it doesn't then it's not i.e. commercial) then as @panini pointed out, the cake may be denser than expected.

 

in the end, I'm confident it will turn out great because you will undoubtedly add the best ingredient of all, LOVE.

 

Luc H.

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post #14 of 24
Thread Starter 

Thanks Luc H.! Yes, I hope all the LOVE for my son will help make this a delicious cake.

post #15 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luc_H View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlerk76 View Post

If I use 1 cup whole wheat bread flour (strong) and 1 cup All purpose flour, instead of 2 cups whole wheat flour

That is your only substitution, the rest of the recipe remains the same.

I personally would've preferred the cornstarch sub to lighten the cake.

 

as @flipflopgirl pointed out, the recipe you're going for is quite dense to start and this substitution will not necessary help at making it lighter so heed her instructions above

 

If your bread flour specifically claims to be hard wheat (if it doesn't then it's not i.e. commercial) then as @panini pointed out, the cake may be denser than expected.

 

in the end, I'm confident it will turn out great because you will undoubtedly add the best ingredient of all, LOVE.

 

Luc H.

 

I see I confused the whole texture issue for everyone lol.

 

I love a dense spicy cake (my go to is an oil cake recipe with a runny batter...only changing the spices and fruit and nuts around) and the one in question (the carrot and raisin) is written to be dense...

Whether on purpose or by accident.... the wet fruits will provide what is lacking (eggs and oil).

Sort of.

 

Tough is another issue altogether.

A tough product is one in which the batter has been over worked and it ends up dry and chewy (think the worst muffin you have ever eaten..)

Without oil or sugar it will most likely end up a bit tough but there are trade offs with this type of ( allergy free) baking.

 

I often mix AP and WW flour when trying to get a bit more fiber into a recipe.

When I do it is mixed by hand (the fold technique above) and get it into the oven quickly.

One particular fave has the 2 flours as well as oatmeal (and blueberries) baked as either muffins or a crumb cake....

Delish!

 

mimi

 

I will throw heavy in just because ....

The recipe as written would have sat in the tummy like a brick.

With the flour and mixing subs it has the chance to be a bit lighter.

 

m.


Edited by flipflopgirl - 8/1/15 at 8:18am
post #16 of 24

@flipflopgirl ,

  Don't go listening to @Luc_H ,

I have to put a finger in each ear and blah, blah, blah!  He is giving away industry secrets about whole wheat flour. I don't think he knows the dangers of doing that.

I love whole wheat bread. I don't buy whole wheat flour in the grocery store. I am really fortunate to be close to a Great Harvest Bakery. They do a pretty good job

with their basic whole wheat bread. They grind a hard WW daily. They use WW flour, water, yeast, salt and Texas Range Honey.

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post #17 of 24

@flipflopgirl

Don't you listen to @panini he's a food snob hipster who doesn't live in the real world! (but who is truly fortunate though)

wink!

Luc H.

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post #18 of 24

Does a heart good to see the mutual respect and admiration exchanged between CT members ;-)

But if this pi##ing contest continues I will be forced to send them to their rooms without supper!

 

@Vlerk76  please let us know how the cake turns out.....

Happy indeed is a birthday boy whose mom makes his cake with her own loving hands....

Take lots of pix so you will have proof later lol.

 

mimi

post #19 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by panini View Post
 

@flipflopgirl ,

  Don't go listening to @Luc_H ,

I have to put a finger in each ear and blah, blah, blah!  He is giving away industry secrets about whole wheat flour. I don't think he knows the dangers of doing that.

I love whole wheat bread. I don't buy whole wheat flour in the grocery store. I am really fortunate to be close to a Great Harvest Bakery. They do a pretty good job

with their basic whole wheat bread. They grind a hard WW daily. They use WW flour, water, yeast, salt and Texas Range Honey.

 

Quicha braggin' and overnite me a loaf!

 

mimi

post #20 of 24

@Luc_H

 You know you're so right. I am "The Tableside Critic". I sometimes have to try new places alone. Most of my friends hate going out with me, I'm critical of most

everything. My wife bailed on going out to eat with me almost 20 yrs. ago.

Check it out

http://www.thrillist.com/eat/nation/food-snobs-different-types-of-food-enthusiasts

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post #21 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by flipflopgirl View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by panini View Post
 

@flipflopgirl ,

  Don't go listening to @Luc_H ,

I have to put a finger in each ear and blah, blah, blah!  He is giving away industry secrets about whole wheat flour. I don't think he knows the dangers of doing that.

I love whole wheat bread. I don't buy whole wheat flour in the grocery store. I am really fortunate to be close to a Great Harvest Bakery. They do a pretty good job

with their basic whole wheat bread. They grind a hard WW daily. They use WW flour, water, yeast, salt and Texas Range Honey.

 

Quicha braggin' and overnite me a loaf!

 

mimi

 

Maybe a trade can be exchanged....

The peaches were exceptionally nice this year... and to sweeten the pot I will allow you to choose between a jar of preserves or a fresh cobbler with an almond crumb topping (I will present it in a throw down Styrofoam cooler to keep it nice and warm).

I will meet you halfway (maybe Corsicanna so I can catch up with an old friend over tea and fresh bread) and exchange the goods.

There will be watchers so come alone :laser:

 

m.

post #22 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by panini View Post
 

@Luc_H

 You know you're so right. I am "The Tableside Critic". I sometimes have to try new places alone. Most of my friends hate going out with me, I'm critical of most

everything. My wife bailed on going out to eat with me almost 20 yrs. ago.

Check it out

http://www.thrillist.com/eat/nation/food-snobs-different-types-of-food-enthusiasts

Sorry to hear that man... still want to meet ya one day though, to casser la croûte

I (we) critic in a different way when I go to restaurants with food industry peers: is it authentic cooking or commercial food service food? like "ooo this roast beef tastes like it's been injected with tons of HVPs! the chef probably used a soup mix or has his meat injected by XYZ Co"

 

from the snob types I would probably be:

The Frenchman

He is constantly mistaken for a foodie, but he’s eating foie gras because he likes it, not because he read about it on Eater. And he sounds condescending because he’s from Marseille, ahem! Montréal (i.e. The Great White North)

 

Luc H.

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post #23 of 24

No!  Not Corsicana!!!  The place is crawling with ICE. They're raiding everything.  They are supposedly there to pick up migrants with a felony or greater criminal backgrounds. NOT!!

They are scooping up everyone, criminal record or not. Leaving young kids to head up and support whole families. Who's gonna bake the fruitcakes or dip the chocolates? Gotta love Government!  All this while they are inditing our attorney general on felony charges.

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post #24 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by panini View Post
 

No!  Not Corsicana!!!  The place is crawling with ICE. They're raiding everything.  They are supposedly there to pick up migrants with a felony or greater criminal backgrounds. NOT!!

They are scooping up everyone, criminal record or not. Leaving young kids to head up and support whole families. Who's gonna bake the fruitcakes or dip the chocolates? Gotta love Government!  All this while they are inditing our attorney general on felony charges.

 

This is disturbing news.

I wonder if my friend was included in the roundup....

Maybe I should call (if she was then all the adults at her home were) and see if those kids need help before CPS comes thru and places all my honorary nieces and nephews in the system.

Good people...work hard...go to church every week...send their kids to school and speak only English in public.

 

About our "head cop in Austin"....the following was a rant on greedy career politicians and since this is not allowed (rightly so) on CT it was deleted.

 

mimi

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