I am writing a piece on commercial ranges both for restaurant use, and for home use.
What subjects are important to have in this article?
Anything goes here, simply what is important to you on this subject?
Just want to add
1. Residential can go in Commercial. 2. Commercial usually can't go in Residential
1. This will usually result in premature death. Sometime needs and energy adaptation.
2. Usually will need a different energy source. Gas and Electric. Major heat concern, they emit a lot of heat . They are not insulated like ...residential.
When you say residential can go in commercial. Do you mean you can use a residential range in a commercial setting? Meaning it is possible, but am I guessing it is more un-reliable? When you say you can not use a commercial range in a residential setting, that is because of the heat released, and possibly insulation issues on the side? Thanks!
May I suggest looking at a few commercial range sites (Vulcan, Garland, Southbend, US range, etc) to seejust exactly what a commercial range is all about?
Let's take a typical commercial range, a 4 eye (4 burner) with an oven underneath.
Each burner puts out a minimum of 28,000 btu's, with some models as high as 35,000. I know of no residential range that goes above 22,000 btus.
Then the oven has an additional 30,000 btu burner.
So, theoretically, a 4-eye range can consume 150,000 btus per hour. This means a larger gas line--usually what's called a "one pound (lb) line" for commerical applications. Most residential applications only have a "one inch" gas line, which is not sufficient to feed a commercial range. In addition, if one were to hook up a commercial unit to residential gas line, you might affect gas delivery to many other homes in the immediate area.
Assuming you had a commerical unit in a home, you would need a lot of air to feed that much firepower, and of course, assuming that you ran all four burners, you would put out a LOT of heat into your kitchen, not to mention grease/oil mist from frying pans, or water vapor (steam). Most residential kitchen ventilation is a pathetic farce that couldn't handle a drunkard's beer fart.
In addition, commercial units have lousy insulation compared to residential units, and most commercial factory spec's require at least 6" away from any walls.
But here's the kicker:
Check out the pricing on a plain-Jane 4-eye commercial range, and it will be under $2,800. Most halfway decent residential units that don't have burners made from recycled beer cans start at well over $3,500 and go up, up, up, dramatically.
Does this help?
I have a Southbend range - six burners, two ovens, griddle and salamander. Commercial hood too with a restaurant fan in the basement piped outside. It's tucked into a wall that is tile over cement board on steel studs with fireproof insulating bats and a tile floor. I have a 1/2" LP line feeding it and it works great. You get more BTUs from LP than natural gas. It's probably 30 years old and works like a champ.
I am researching installing a commercial Southbend range in a home I am building currently and can tell you what I have learned from the dealer and the city as well as the insurance company.
City, Cedar Park Texas --- There is no requirement other than to meet all manufacturers instillation requirements and have a class 1 hood installed with active fire suppression.
Insurance company, USAA --- Same as above with no other requirements except one. If it is to be used for a commercial business in a home it requires carrying policy suited to a commercial operation (B&B, rental kitchen, popup restaurant) rather than a residential one. This policy also dictates inspection cycles on the hood, stove and fire suppression and yearly certification.
Dealer, Southbend --- If it is to be installed in a residence without a commercial operation or intent the warranty will likely be voided. This would necessitate any part and labor be paid for by you though the official Southbend repair technician would still repair it. It requires a larger gas line, usually 3/4", if installed with less than 6" of clearance must be lined with nonflammable surface like tile or fire-board.
Cost --- Its far cheaper than the equivalent residential with some features you just cannot get on any residential. The cost of a residential in the size I want is a full 2X the cost of a commercial range, even when I special order several common residential features and buy the higher model commercial unit. The higher end "Ultimate" line has better insulation than standard commercial S series and can be ordered with electric spark ignition eliminating standing pilot hand lighting issues.
Features that cannot be had otherwise --- Full commercial depth allowing 2 large pots to sit front to back on the range and full size sheet pans. No electronic gizmos to break and no silly features I'm not going to use. Very heavy and heavy duty from burners to oven doors, they are sledgehammer tough. The range I'm looking at is several hundred lbs.
Warranty --- I don't really much care about the warranty since there are very very few things that can break compared to a residential line. If they do break I can pay for alot of thermostats and ignitors before ever touching the cost of a residential 60" Thermador
I am building the home currently and can take all these into consideration at build time meaning my cost to install is minimal compared to someone who has to retrofit. The cabinetry will be extra depth to match the oven and its in a stone surround shared with a brick oven. This allows me to install the ugly fire suppression stuff either behind the oven wall on the utility room wall or even inside the wood storage cabinet under the brick oven.
6-7 K for the Southbend, 2K hood, 2K fire suppression, 2k installation w/plumbing.
I'm in Texas, in my jurisdiction if there is a requirement for fire suppression system, commercial or residential, they will require inspection and rotation + on site documentation of grease cleaning.
Now with the approved Home Cottage Kitchens a 3/4" tap is considered a commercial need. A commercial tap usually requires separate ins. coverage for receiving area. This also needs to be disclosed to homeowners ins. provider which usually results in doubled + rates. If not disclosed, recent rulings for fire usually releases any liability on the homeowners insurance. Of course you can elect to have an event investigated, but those cost usually exceed ones losses.
No electric gizmos, that means pilot lights. Wasted energy. Produces unusable heat. Ovens will be 180+ while dormant. I know this because we use them to melt chocolate. One or two pilots up top will elevate room temp a few degrees constantly. Pretty sure the vent will require two motors. One for make up air if there is a suppression installed. Southbend, no insulation at all, gaskets are usually far less efficient because they usually endure abuse and are changed frequently.
I'm also pretty sure the 3'4 tap will require a commercial permit which means the contractor will sub out the tap to a commercial plumber who will require running his own line for permit inspection.
Had this discussion before Ice Man, I am glad to have you add your WOW factor.
cgriffin I think your cost estimate is low.
This is from another thread with the same discussion. I installed a Vulcan 60” range in my house last year.
Yes it is installed. My cost including the equipment was $15,000 +-. I did much of the work myself and some of the materials including the hood were from a demolition job. There is no code department in my area. At one time in my life I worked as an engineer and a licensed contractor. My installation meets national recommended codes. If I were estimating this job for a client I would estimate $30,000 plus for new construction more for rebuild.
range 7000. hood 2500, fire suppression 2500, fans 3000, Elec 1500, ducting 5000, Gas 1500, plans and permits 3000 = 26000 plan on a budget of 30000.
Did your quote from Hoodmart include fans? Does your stove instillation include plumbing? How much will it cost to install hood, ducting, and fans? Remember the duct is a double walled. When I evaluated a quote from Hoodmart and I have nothing negative to say about them I chose another source. Good luck with your project.