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Is CCK 1303 Lacquer Food Safe?

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 

Hi Everyone,

 

I hope this is the right place to post this. I just joined so I am not sure of the protocol.

 

I am on the verge of ordering one or possibly two CCK cleavers. Likely a 1302 and an 1103 if I feel like spoiling myself for Christmas. I just got to wondering if there might be any cause for concern with the lacquer on the CCK 1300 series cleavers? I am one of those people that will not use no-stick fry pans etc. You know the type... I assume this lacquer wears off over time, which means you end up eating it over time too. Does anyone know what is in the lacquer and if this is safe? Are there any kind of chinese regulations regarding  this and are they enforced?

 

I hate to sound alarmist but I will likely prepare the vast majority of my family's food with this knife so I need to know if there is any health risk, even it that risk may be quite remote. I suppose I could always remove the lacquer but I am not really looking for extra projects and I gather the knife is a real rust magnet without it. The 1103 may be a better choice in that regard but I think that I would really like the size of the 1302 for the majority of what I chop in the kitchen. Any thoughts, information, or suggestions greatly appreciated! Thanks!

 

Gareth 

post #2 of 15

Welcome. Use acetone or some other laquer remover and get rid of it.

Then you slowly build a patina and voilá, you got a great non laquered cleaver.

Gebe Gott uns allen, uns Trinkern, einen so leichten und so schönen Tod! Joseph Roth.
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Gebe Gott uns allen, uns Trinkern, einen so leichten und so schönen Tod! Joseph Roth.
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post #3 of 15
Thread Starter 

Thanks Ordo. Do I just take the acetone - nail polish remover? - soak a rag and rub off the lacquer? Does it come off fairly easily? What about that black paint or whatever it is on the top half of the blade? Do I need to worry about that? Will come off, or partially come off with the acetone treatment? Apologies for all the questions! Just want to know what I am signing up for!

 

Thanks so much!

Garth

post #4 of 15

The black is not paint. It's just a finishing that eventually will help not to rust the hole blade. Just get rid of the laquer, use the blade, wash it, pat dry it carefully and use it and use it again and repeat the process.. A patina (a controled form of rust) will hopefully build there. You have a nice cleaver!

Gebe Gott uns allen, uns Trinkern, einen so leichten und so schönen Tod! Joseph Roth.
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Gebe Gott uns allen, uns Trinkern, einen so leichten und so schönen Tod! Joseph Roth.
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post #5 of 15

@Gareth38 I agree with ordo.  Nail polish remover (acetone) will get the trick done.  Cotton balls or paper towel in a pinch.

 

I had the 1303 (small cleaver).  It is insanely thin.  I still have the 1103, still a super thin slicer.  Edge holding is just okay on the CCKs.  FWIW  I would recommend the Suien VC at JCK selling for $144 right now.  I think it's more than 40% better.  Much better steel.  It needs like 5 minutes of thinning behind the edge and then it is a winner.

post #6 of 15

@Gareth38,

Just wondering why you would want two cleaver that are very similar? I use my 1302 all the time. I think the 1303 is just a tad smaller or the other way around. They are a little dangerous in the beginning because they are very light.

The acetone is the best thing to get of the coating which, I think is a vinyl coating. When you use that acetone make sure you done just swirl it around. You have to follow each wipe with a fresh paper towel so you don't leave any on the blade. I made this mistake on another carbon and when it patina'd it looked like it had scratches. Probably most won't agree with this but sometimes I forget and just lay my knife in the cupboard after use with no prep. I can being it right back with bar keepers friend. It's like a non abrasive comet.

FOR YEARS I LIVED TO WORK! NOW I WORK TO LIVE!
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FOR YEARS I LIVED TO WORK! NOW I WORK TO LIVE!
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post #7 of 15

@Gareth38,

I just looked at JCK. and the VC That MillionsSteel mentioned, I think the info on steel itself is interesting. I'm sure he's right about it being a better steel. I'm assuming the VC is for Virgin Steel. From what I know of metals a very little bit of blacksmithing. Virgin steel is made from raw materials, so there is less impurities in the steel  it has more carbides and tighter structure along with other things and It ends up to be a better steel. There is a whole lot more to it but I think that the scoop on VC.

Many other steel is made up from m ixed reusable steel.

I am certainly going to look in the the Suien.

Of course steel making is very secretive amongst producers. Japanese and Chinese give steel their own names. Truth be told, most of these types of metals were developed right here in the US. Steel got to be too expensive to produce so others ripped off the formulas. I'm just now trying to educated myself on the powders. So much talk about using RWL-34 for knives, but it's basically Swedish Stainless. Go figure.

FOR YEARS I LIVED TO WORK! NOW I WORK TO LIVE!
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FOR YEARS I LIVED TO WORK! NOW I WORK TO LIVE!
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post #8 of 15
Thread Starter 

Good to know re. the black portion of the blade. Sounds like maybe some kind of anodized treatment that will not wear off? I have heard people say they rust just by looking at them with the lacquer removed but I am hoping that with proper care and a forced patina I should be fine. I am pretty meticulous with these kinds of things.

 

Thanks!

post #9 of 15
Thread Starter 

Thanks Panini. Good to know about the acetone and how to use it properly. If that lacquer is some kind of plastic compound I sure wouldn't want it ending up in my family's food as it wears off the blade over time! Re. getting two knives so close in size, just to be clear, it is the 1302 - slightly larger than 1303 at 21.5 x 9.5 cm. - and the 1103 at 22.5 x 11.5 cm. I have thought the same thing though, that it might be a little silly to have two vegetable slicing cleavers but the difference does seem like it could be fairly significant. At least significant enough that I may prefer one over the other and I ma having a difficult time deciding! I have used a cleaver a little smaller that a 1303 for just about everything for the last almost 20 years so I know I would get on fine with the 1300 series but am also curious about whether I might really, or possibly prefer, the larger slicer. No option to try before I buy here in Victoria though. Fortunately here in Victoria, they are available just across the straight at the CCK distributor in Vancouver so it is a quick and easy shipment.

Gareth

post #10 of 15
Thread Starter 

Hi Millions,

 

I hear you on the Suien VC. I have looked at that too and considered it. However I can get a CCK 1302 for $70. CAD and a 1103 for $95. CAD from the CCK distributor in Vancouver whereas the Suien will end up being $200. CAD plus the possible hassle of shipping internationally from Japan. I could get both a 1302 and a 1103, shipped and tax paid for about the same as one Suien. Not sure I will do that though, I amy just go for the 1302. I know that the Suien is a better knife, better steel, better workmanship, more nicely finished. However I also gather from folks here that have a some of the higher end cleavers that when it comes to the job of slicing through vegetables the CCK's really hold there own with cleavers costing much more. I also kind of like having a bit of a rough'n ready knife similar to what you might find someone actually using in China. I know the CCK's will need to be sharpened a little more frequently than some better japanese knives but I also gather that they are pretty easy to sharpen and I do not think it should be an overly time consuming job. 

 

cheers,

Garth

post #11 of 15

Shibazi cleavers are also good. Very well known Chinese brand. I got one years ago.

 

 

 

$24,75 in Amazon.

Gebe Gott uns allen, uns Trinkern, einen so leichten und so schönen Tod! Joseph Roth.
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Gebe Gott uns allen, uns Trinkern, einen so leichten und so schönen Tod! Joseph Roth.
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post #12 of 15

Shibazi's can be hit-or-miss, especially at the lower end.  To a certain degree, the tip-off can be the specific steel used.  I bought a ShhBaZi made from 4Cr13 - bit of garbage.  Wouldn't hold an edge.  On the other hand, if it's a ShiBaZi made from 8Cr13MoV, it's probably a good steel and will be a very decent performer. 

 

Allegedly, ShiBaZi in the past has even made clad blades.  But those may have been seen as simply a passing fad and didn't sell in China.

 

The problem in finding the good stuff is that there's a lot of extra wordage that simply is advertising hype.  "High Carbon Stainless Steel" is precisely the type of language which doesn't say anything, but sounds impressive.  And usually, there's nothing in the written description about what specific type of steel is used

 

As for me, my tendency is to look on eBay for old fashioned carbon steel (non-stainless) Chinese cleavers.  At least with those, I can be reasonably assured that the knife will have a better chance of holding an edge.

 

 

Galley Swiller

post #13 of 15

I suddenly wished I remembered but someone somewhere was talking about a cheap carbon line of Chinese knives and cleavers, something like "Choubu." 

 

 

 

Rick

post #14 of 15

My case is worst. In 2009 i've been in China for almost 3 months and i was accompanied to a knife producer's city whose name i can't remember. A multitud of exceptional cleavers, carbon steel, SS, slicers, choppers, etc., etc. was presented to me and guess what?: I DIDN'T BUY A SINGLE CLEAVER CAUSE OF THE WEIGHT OF OUR ABSURD LUGGAGE, MORE THAN 100 KILOGRAMS OF WOMEN CLOTHES!

Gebe Gott uns allen, uns Trinkern, einen so leichten und so schönen Tod! Joseph Roth.
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Gebe Gott uns allen, uns Trinkern, einen so leichten und so schönen Tod! Joseph Roth.
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post #15 of 15

Ahahahaha, in my case it would have been hundreds of kilos of furnishings and chachkis, if not for being saved by the shipping charges.

 

 

 

Rick

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