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Trying to find the right time for a 3 1/2 lb pork roast to make pulled pork sandwiches. - Page 2

post #31 of 51
Somewhere on this site are conversations with Steven Raichlin, the barbeque master. I questioned his barbeque ing a prime rib as wasteful and ridiculous. I recall being more polite than that but maybe what was on my mind and in my heart was more transparent than I intended. His response was "try it; you may like it". Many of his BBQ concepts deviate from tradition in wild ways but many are simply expressing regional differences. It takes a village...
post #32 of 51
Thread Starter 

They should put a warning on all packages of lean meat, "do not attempt to bbq, and if you do, don't tell ANYONE!!" LOL.

post #33 of 51
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianShaw View Post
His response was "try it; you may like it". Many of his BBQ concepts deviate from tradition in wild ways but many are simply expressing regional differences. It takes a village...

Completely agree 100% Brian.

post #34 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by hellno187 View Post
 

Right, I use indirect heat and cook it really slow and low or what Forkful calls bbqing.

It depends on what you consider low and slow.  There are cuts of meat that benefit from low and slow and there are cuts of meat (like tenderloin) where it's just a waste of time.

"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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post #35 of 51
I've smoked tenderloin with great results. If you're looking for even cooking and the whole thing to end up at the right doneness it's not a waste of time.
post #36 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianShaw View Post

LOL... I suppose you can say that, but I think there is another part of the definition - end product results and or usage. I can "low and slow" indirect heat a frankfurter on a gas barbeque grill to reheat that pre cooked food product. One could call that BBQ if one wants, I suppose, but most wouldn't.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianShaw View Post

But it really doesn't matter as long as the result is eatable. Common lingo just makes the discussion easier. But you know that already. wink.gif

 

Totally agree!!!  As I stated the lines between indirect grilling and barbecuing are pretty fluid, in my opinion.  It mostly comes down to time and temperature, but of course you can find definitions all over the place for barbecue, from very specific definitions created by BBQ enthusiasts to very broad definitions such as the ones from Webster's Dictionary:

     1 :  to roast or broil on a rack or revolving spit over or before a source of heat (as hot coals)

     2 :  to cook in a highly seasoned vinegar sauce

 

I know guys that slap burgers on a grill, over high heat and call that barbecuing (I also come from Wisconsin where they use the term "Steak Fry" for grilling out steaks).  Sure, these terms can be used interchangeably and for many people this is the case.  But I find that it muddies the waters when it comes to discussions about grilling and barbecuing.  That is why I try to set definitions before having any discussion to ensure that we are comparing apples to apples and not apples to oranges (as Brian said).

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellno187 View Post
 


Yeah it works out really well, I'm not sure why all the hoopla over cooking lean pork on a gas grill because there are tons of recipes on doing just that.

In fact I received a new email recipe on cooking a pork tenderloin on a gas grill from Allrecipes just this morning lol.

 

 

No hoopla at all over cooking lean pork on a gas grill.  I do pork chops, pork loin, and pork tenderloin on my gas grill, my charcoal grill and in smoker all the time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellno187 View Post
 

So if I use the term bbq like this in the wrong place I can be drug out in the street and shot huh? LOL, good to know.

 

Not shot, but there are definitely sites that are dedicated to the art of barbecue that would be much less inclined to have a civil conversation with those that don't agree with their definition of barbecue.  While I tend to align myself with their definition I don't subscribe to belittling people because they choose to use the term in other ways.  That doesn't stop me though, from trying to educate people why I believe that these very loose interpretations of the term barbecue don't cut it.

post #37 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by MillionsKnives View Post

I've smoked tenderloin with great results. If you're looking for even cooking and the whole thing to end up at the right doneness it's not a waste of time.

 

I've smoked many a tenderloin, both beef and pork with fantastic results.  Done them both with cold smoke to cook later and with hot smoke, cooking them while they smoked.  Love them both ways!

post #38 of 51
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by teamfat View Post
 

grilling is not bbq.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete View Post
 

 

Totally agree.


This was meant to educate me, my bad, I guess I must have misinterpreted or something I apologize. Thanks for the educating Pete.

post #39 of 51

My initial post was overly terse and could be taken as rude, I should have explained the reasoning behind the comment. It seems others have stepped in and taken care of that aspect of it.

 

Another possible point of contention:

 

 

This is a picture of two pork TENDERLOINS. They weigh on the order of a pound or so each, diameter of a small apple, maybe a foot long. If you "barbecue" these for hours and bring them to an internal temp of 200F like you would a pork shoulder, they would be suitable for shoe repair, perhaps fixing leaky shingles.  Dinner, not so much.

 

Next photo:

 

 

This is a picture of a pork LOIN. About the diameter of a large grapefruit. A whole one can be over 2 feet long, maybe 3. weighs in at many pounds. Usual market cuts are 2 - 3 pounds, 8 - 12 inches long. Still a very lean cut when it comes from commodity pork, easy to overcook and dry out. Often sold with some tag such as "Moist and Tender" or "Guaranteed Tender" on the package, which indicates you are not buying a pound of pork, you are buying 14 ounces of pork and 2 ounces of salt water, deep marinade as the industry calls it.

 

Many often confuse these cuts.

 

mjb.

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post #40 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by hellno187 View Post



This was meant to educate me, my bad, I guess I must have misinterpreted or something I apologize. Thanks for the educating Pete.

If you are bent out of shape because I agreed with teamfat's comment then that is on you. I have posted a few things to this thread that have explained my view points on barbecue vs. grilling. They have all been respectful and, although I disagree with your take on things, I have not been belittling in any way. But ultimately I agree with teamfat's statement that grilling is not barbecuing. If you wish to view it otherwise that's on you.
post #41 of 51

Here's my take......

Grilling........Hot Direct Heat

 

Barbecuing......As in I'm going to make some BBQ.

Indirect heat, lower temp, longer times. 12+ hrs on this brisket.

 

 

post #42 of 51
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete View Post


If you are bent out of shape because I agreed with teamfat's comment then that is on you. I have posted a few things to this thread that have explained my view points on barbecue vs. grilling. They have all been respectful and, although I disagree with your take on things, I have not been belittling in any way. But ultimately I agree with teamfat's statement that grilling is not barbecuing. If you wish to view it otherwise that's on you.

LOL, even when I apologize it's my fault.

post #43 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by hellno187 View Post
 

LOL, even when I apologize it's my fault.

 

I think this is getting all blown out of proportion because of semantics and traditional technique.  It is obvious from your posts you understand the difference between grilling and BBQing.  So far, so good.  The problem comes down to your choice of cut for the BBQing.  Pork Shoulder (aka Boston Butt) is best cut for BBQing  (which I think you used, albeit a small on, but you did mention tenderloin and roast which are different)  It has enough fat content that you can cook it to 200 deg without it becoming dry.  Pork Loin and Tenderloin as I'm sure you know, are much leaner cuts so are not traditionally used in BBQ.  You can do it, but you should not cook it to 200.  145 is about right.  That is why many said to just grill a lean cut instead of BBQ.  You can do a long, low and slow on a pork tenderloin, and it could still be tasty.  However, I'll bet that if you put that one next to one that was done direct grill to proper temp, you would prefer the one that was direct grilled. 

 

I was questioned the other day for doing a whole chicken at 275 for 3.5 hours when the proper way is 350 for 1.5 - 2 hours.  The reason I did it that was was because i was doing "beer can" method and had the cavity sealed to steam from inside out.  There are exceptions for every rule, but rules have been in place for a long time because they are tried and true methods for many years.

 

I hope you don't feel too ganged up on.  People here are very passionate about food and cooking, but are for the most part very nice and helpful.  I think they are just trying to help you to make the best food you possibly can.  That's how i see it anyway

post #44 of 51
Thread Starter 

Thanks for the info and reply Planethoff and yes I started this thread with a question about a pork shoulder, and no I don't feel ganged up on. At first it kinda felt that way, but I believe I misinterpreted or something, which happens with this form of communication being you can't see the other persons face/mannerisms which help to interpret intent. However, most everyone has been really cool and replied with clarification on intent just to clear things up like teamfat, which I much appreciate (I gave him a thumbs up lol). I 100% understand the passion behind cooking that's why I come here for answers to my questions, because as my profile states I'm just a home cook I have no formal training or education. I'll have to try putting my tenderloin over direct heat again, since it seems most everyone here thinks it's the best way to cook it on a gas grill. I haven't been because the first couple of times I tried it didn't turn out as good as the tenderloin I've cooked indirectly, but that could have been mistakes on my part. Thanks again Planethoff :thumb:.

post #45 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by hellno187 View Post

I'll have to try putting my tenderloin over direct heat again, since it seems most everyone here thinks it's the best way to cook it on a gas grill. I haven't been because the first couple of times I tried it didn't turn out as good as the tenderloin I've cooked indirectly, but that could have been mistakes on my part.

A great way is to brown it on direct then move it to indirect. Just use higher temp to cook and make sure to pull off at proper temp. You can probably pull off at 140 and rest until 145. But it will not pull like pulled pork. It will slice. But still be very tender. Good luck and if you have any questions, you hopefully know where to go smile.gif
post #46 of 51

Tenderloin is a very small, lean cut that is quite easily overcooked, it does take some care to do properly.

 

mjb.

Food nourishes my body.  Cooking nourishes my soul.
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post #47 of 51

Wow...this really blew up!

 

1st off...just let me say that as a North Carolina boy the term "barbecuing" is not in our dictionary.  Nor do we have a piece of equipment called "a barbecue".  LoL

 

2nd...I venture to say I could cook a barbecued tenderloin or backloin if I wanted to.  Common sense would tell "me" not to take it to 200 degrees...I'd probably pull it 150-155...and I'd still comfortably call it "barbecued pork loin".  It doesn't have to be fall apart done to be barbecued...you know how you'd be laughed at with a fall apart brisket, fall apart ribs, fall apart chicken, etc?  LoL

 

3rd (and back to the original topic)...If you're cooking a butt and it gets done sooner than you expected, no problem don't freak out.  You're going to lose your bark...but wrap it in foil, and put it in a small cooler that you pack full of towels.  I will put a towel on the bottom, put the wrapped butt on top of that, and pack towels around and on top of it to reduce the air space.  Close the cooler and don't open it again until you're ready to prep the meat.  It'll still be too hot to touch hours later.

 

Barbecue isn't something to get all freaked out about.  I tell people all the time that it's the easiest meal you'll ever cook.  That statement usually gets me some strange looks, and quite often some heated responses.  But anyone who takes offense to hearing that just needs to be reminded that they worry about it too much.  Learn to not worry about the process, cook, and let it happen.

post #48 of 51

I had a bit of a laugh reading through this thread :)

 

For me (Northern European) a barbecue is something that you fill up with charcoal and cook on.

So barbecueing applies to everything cooked on a barbecue, regardless of the temperature.

Grilling is what you do in the oven, on the highest heat.

 

Then I started reading some of the BBQ fora and the terminology there is definitely different.

So depending on who I talk to, I will adjust my terminology, so it is clear to the others.

It still baffles me at times and I would rather use "hot and fast", "low and slow" "indirect" "direct" "hot and slow" etc instead of barbecueing and grilling.

 

But hey, at least I do know (or I think I know) what people are talking about.

 

@Pete, thanks for that link. I missed it and am going to read it now

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post #49 of 51
@butzy it's not confusing just for you, I grew up in America and have lived in the north and south and I'm still confused about the terminology to use. I understand the technical difference between grilling and smoking but we say "come to our BBQ" or "we're having a cookout". BBQ is a loaded term.

"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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"You are what you eat, so don't be fast, cheap, easy, or fake."

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post #50 of 51

For those who are confused, this should clear it up.

 

http://Barbeque Defined

 

If you don't understand after reading this, in it's entirety, you are beyond help :)

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post #51 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koukouvagia View Post

@butzy it's not confusing just for you, I grew up in America and have lived in the north and south and I'm still confused about the terminology to use. I understand the technical difference between grilling and smoking but we say "come to our BBQ" or "we're having a cookout". BBQ is a loaded term.

To add to your confusion a lot of the BBQ joints around the south serve a loaded potato. So BBQ can be a loaded term.  Do you like the vinegar based sauce or the sweet red? 

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