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post #61 of 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by rndmchef View Post

A way of expression? Yea, so is murder and terrorist attacks; but I don't think those are good ideas either.

 

 

I actually had so much to say, but after re-reading your posts about God (BTW which god considering that there are still hundreds being worshipped on this planet) and the fact that you seriously just compared being tattooed, as a form of expression, to murder and terrorism, I can only assume that you are either:

1. Trolling this forum

2. completely off your rocker

 

Either way, I can't continue with this conversation, with you, any longer.

post #62 of 76

Karl,

You need to be careful with that word discriminatory.  Not hiring someone because they have tattoos is not, in the legal sense discriminatory as it does not fall under 1 of the "protected" categories.  As an owner of a business where our employees interact with our customers every day we often make hiring decisions either consciously or subconsciously based on looks.  Hippest, newest night club-I bet the hostess won't be a heavy set 40 year old woman, new, trendy ramen place-good bet most servers will have full sleeve tattoos, new French fine dining place-probably no facial piercings on the waitstaff.  I am not making judgments about those decisions merely pointing out that those are perfectly legal hiring decisions that can be made by the owners.

 

Do I wholeheartedly disagree with the stance that some have taken of tattoos?  Yes I do, but they have a right, as owners, or decision makers to decide not to hire someone based on the fact that they have visible tattoos that can't be covered up.  Personally, I find such decisions to be shortsighted but that is me and I am not running their kitchens.

post #63 of 76
Theres an established fast food chain here that refuses to hire anyone with any facial hair whatsoever, including neatly trimmed mustaches. They've been steadfast on this for decades--if it were legally discriminatory, they would have been called out on it years ago.

My eldest daughter has tats....(and maybe I shouldnt even dare broach the subject of body piercings!). Not because shes rebellious, or has an identity crisis, or is making a statement to the world. But because theyre pretty, and she likes them. My other 3 by-products have no tats.
My wife wants one, if i gifted her one someday she'd be ecstatic. Personally, i have no tatooial appetites. Neither do I desire piercings--I like
my pain receptors just the way they are-- unstimulated.
Which has nothing to do with my reactions to deco-people. However, I cant say I wont react a bit to content....if i see someone with a swastika proudly displayed on their arm i might have a personal problem with that, regardless of their right to self expression.

*scrolls back to page one*
Oh yeah.....
Last job position/title:
--Line Cook.
--Duties/ responsibilities/ accomplishments, see long list below:
(The list will speak for itself, use addtional sheets as needed!!)
Edited by Meezenplaz - 9/7/16 at 9:29pm
post #64 of 76
[quote name="youngchefkarl" url="/t/90334/question/30#post_545279... and one of the problems with the world, being judgemental. [/quote]


Yeah, I know, but... People ARE judgemental.

Heck, I judge when its time to toss out my toothbrush, I judge its not safe to cross the street when I can't make eye contact with the lady in the Prius who is staring at her crotch, both hands texting away. I judge the customer who wants to order a special order cake but refuses to put a deposit down, a scammer and a waste of my time.

People judge.
...."This whole reality thing is really not what I expected it would be"......
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...."This whole reality thing is really not what I expected it would be"......
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post #65 of 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by rndmchef View Post

And people seriously wonder why our generation is going down the toilet? People wonder why we expect everything we want; the older generation wonders why we are lazy sloths. ... And just FYI; I'm in my mid 20's, so I'm part of this generation....

A way of expression? Yea, so is murder and terrorist attacks; but I don't think those are good ideas either.

Have some self control.

A unique form of expression? I seriously hope that was a joke.

Hey youngster, if it's not expression than you give it a name Mr. know-it-all. Choosing what pants your going to wear is expression. I'm sorry diapers.

If you don't have an understanding why some people choose ink. than don't express your opinion like you do. You don't have a clue.

I got my first ink by moon light with a medics needle and pen ink. I was sitting in a tree with a brother trying to get some sleep. Then there was that paralyzing silence. I still have half a dog tag on my forearm that I always cover. Even in the summer I wear a stretch band over it. That's how I EXPRESS it!  I still wear his dog tags.

That seriously is not a joke. SELF CONTROL !! You'll never know. Try holding it together while someone slides off the limb beside you.  Wake Up! little man.

I may not ever intentionally look at that ink, but it's the most important thing I own.

FOR YEARS I LIVED TO WORK! NOW I WORK TO LIVE!
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FOR YEARS I LIVED TO WORK! NOW I WORK TO LIVE!
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post #66 of 76

Heya @panini try not to let the small minds in life get under your skin. It will ruin the tattoo.....lol!! 

 

As a woman, with a lot of tattoos that are visible, and in the older crowd........I have to laugh at where this thread has taken us with the tattoo thing. I was subjected to HIGHLY judgemental attitudes when I was younger with my tattoos. People used to judge me as lesser than not only because I was a woman but because I had ink on my body (still surprised I wasn't thrown in the travelling circus alongside the wolfman lol). It was MY SELF EXPRESSION however, in that time in history, not a very accepted form of expression. Now in my later years I have to hear this crap again only in the opposite vein as to everyone with tattoos are not expressing themselves but just going with the crowd and fad of it all. OY!!!

 

Although I might agree that there have been a very few amount of people that have passed through my life that regretted getting the ink they did (usually in the younger crowd although not all young) it is still a form of self expression like all art. As well as the beard and moustache trend that is going around today. As much as I may not like the look of the newest trend, that is a personal opinion and is wisely kept to myself. 

 

All that being said, I agree with @Pete post where you hire according to your personal business standards (tattoo and facial hair, or no). It is highly discriminate however that does not make it discriminatory against you as a person. 

 

@foodpump has said, all people are judgemental, that is the human condition to which we live. How we express that judgement, that is on us as an individual (Leave the God's out of it!)

 

@AdamBower998 Chef De Partie will do nicely for the UK on your CV. List your accomplishments and duties alongside and that will do nicely for the next employer. Good luck mate! :D

post #67 of 76

It's funny ... the Military crowd that I'm familiar with has the junkiest tatts. They're all nice pics, proudly displayed in classic military fashion, but generally uninteresting because they are standard regular. The hot chick babe crowd, that I so wish I was more familiar with, has the best looking multi-colored makes-me-wanna-look tatts. Everyone, every day of their lives, makes some kinda statement about their appearance, whether they know it or whether they admit it. We wear clothes that we like. We comb our hair. We try and look as best as we can. I don't  see tatts any differently than a person's hair style, clothing choice or even how their ties match their shirts. Some people do go overboard with the placement and amounts, but that is just like any other fashion. You've never been with a person who overdid their perfume or cologne? I generally have NO problem with tatts ... as long as they're good and not related to gang-type stuff ... and you don't become "The Illustrated Person". I can't at all see tatts effecting work performance. Sorry foodpump, the only judgement I'm concerned with is about the quality of what I serve. For the grace of God, I've never had to worry about anyone's opinion of my wait-staff.

post #68 of 76

No problems, Ice man.

 

If you notice, I say judge, not pre-judge, or rely on stereo types.  I look for responses or actions before I make my judgement, and I base my judgement on these actions, or lack of them.

 

  So for the lady in the Prius, I had no pre-concieved judgement of her until I couldn't make eye contact with her. Then I judged it was probably a good idea to let her finish her (deleted ) text while she was idling at a light before I crossed the street..                       

...."This whole reality thing is really not what I expected it would be"......
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...."This whole reality thing is really not what I expected it would be"......
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post #69 of 76
That's the rub suppose- you're free to get tats if you want but you're self selecting yourself out of certain jobs and even entire fields by doing it. Customers will judge my restaurant as much by the way the servers look as by the food. Where I'm at especially older folks look down on tats, and they have the money. It's a lot easier to change your clothes of facial hair than a tattoo.
"Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but we rather have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit." - Aristotle
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"Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but we rather have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit." - Aristotle
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post #70 of 76
Phaedrus ... That is so very interesting to me. My three(3) best groups of clients, all very different demographically, don't give a rat's tail bit of difference about appearance such as tatts compared to uncleanliness and or sloppiness. All they care for, and come specifically to me for, is what is on the plate and the pairing I give them in the glass. Because I do most of my work privately, it's not in a standard restaurant atmosphere. My waitstaff, or crew as I call them, are almost always different every job. Each and every one of them is a "free agent" for every job.
post #71 of 76
What I find funny, is that I find that, at least in the finer dining places, that customers seem to have a double standard. They want their servers pretty clean cut and conservative, but they don't mind their chefs with full sleeve tattoos. Neck and facial tattoos still seem to make customers somewhat uneasy in finer dining places though, although that does seem to slowly be changing with the rise of the more casual eateries that are doing "serious" food. These statements are not judgments, merely observations.
post #72 of 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete View Post

What I find funny, is that I find that, at least in the finer dining places, that customers seem to have a double standard. They want their servers pretty clean cut and conservative, but they don't mind their chefs with full sleeve tattoos.....

Meh.  Not really when you think about it. These are the same customers who have special requests and 14 modifiers on the dish, tip the server 15-20% of the entire dining experience, and then tell the server to tell the "boys in the back" that the meal was wonderful.......

...."This whole reality thing is really not what I expected it would be"......
Reply
...."This whole reality thing is really not what I expected it would be"......
Reply
post #73 of 76

It's not everyone, Iceman.  We have a good mix of customers but some of the older folks here are kind of stick-in-the-mud types.  It's Minnesota!;)

"Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but we rather have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit." - Aristotle
Reply
"Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but we rather have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit." - Aristotle
Reply
post #74 of 76
Well, this won't end well.
This is a great site, run by and for the professionals in the industry to develop and discuss ideas and share stories. It is also a privately owned forum, which means we play by the house rules. It's not about freedom of speech, it's about following the rules that the site owners have decided to impose. Don't like it? Fine, you are under no obligation to stay.
Go try your luck on an unmoderated forum, and report back to us how that goes for you.

By the way, you're a CDP.

ETA: from the yellow section directly above

Note that even though this is a pro forum, kitchen language is highly discouraged and will result in an infraction or your total removal from cheftalk. Treat fellow professionals with respect as we all pursue our passion.
post #75 of 76
To be honest, the vibes I get from religion are worse than the ones from tattoos. I can respect any man's opinion, but it gets more problematic when the reason for this opinion is the good old book, instead of simple common sense, or just because "I think so". But again I'm just a European heathen, and not from the USA. I understand you've got a different thing going on when it comes to society and religion, and that's fine. I can get with that...

That being said, the word is constantly changing, and so is its views on tattoos and the culinary scene. Get with it or fight it. Whatever you choose, you won't be able to change it.

And about that title. CDP/ chef de partie mean nothing more than responsible for section. In a three man kitchen, what is the third guys title? Sous? Demi chef de partie? Commis? CDP as well? Apprenti? Cuisiner de partie? Saucier? Cuisiner? Or do you just switch around depending on the days choice of socks?
Edited by ljokjel - 9/20/16 at 4:02pm
post #76 of 76
I wouldn't say you're a chef de partie just on the information you've given, what responsibilities have you got in the kitchen other than cooking? Unless you've got proper responsibilities then i wouldn't call you a CDP.
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