[jvous]

Hey!

I'll be starting a new job at a michelin star kitchen. My previous job was in similiar circumstances and I felt my Global 200mm wasn't up to all the jobs which is why I'm seeking a new baby. Also I didn't sharpen it enough, which I will definitely be doing with my new knife.

I've been spending the day reading articles and everyone seem to have a different opinion which is why I'm making my own thread. After reading I felt a 240mm gyuto would suit my needs. However, I'm open to all suggestions. 

I will probably be working larder, so dicing, slicing vegetables and dicing the occasional tuna tartare.

During service there won't be too much time to keep the knife totally clean so I also came to the conclusion that stainless steel would be the best option. 

My budget would be around 75-150€/$. 

Also if you could recommend a stone with the knife.

I would appreciate any sort of advice!

Thanks!

 

[millionsknives]

Hi @jvous and welcome to ChefTalk.

It sounds like you are in the EU? It matters because of what vendors we can recommend with economical/speedy shipping

You're looking for stainless, 240mm gyuto. Are you right handed? What is your handle preference, japanese, western style? Would you be okay with stainless clad carbon? The edge would be exposed carbon and the rest stainless. Easier to sharpen, mostly stain resistant, but you should still practice good cleaning skills.

 

[chrislehrer]

In a professional kitchen, especially on larder/prep, I'd strongly recommend 270, not 240.

Some questions beyond those already posed:

1. How well do you know and understand the general environment of this kitchen? One constantly hears horror stories about knives stolen in pro kitchens, for example. Less horrible but also bad is the common story, "another cook grabbed my knife when he needed something and chipped my edges cutting on a metal table," etc. To what extent are these concerns in your kitchen?

2. What kind of surface are you going to be cutting on? Wood, that rubbery stuff, what? Some knives don't stand up as well if they're not used on wood.

3. How much sharpening experience do you have?

4. How much are you willing to invest in sharpening equipment?

Note: I don't agree that handedness is especially important here. It is true that many Japanese double-beveled knives are set up slightly asymmetrically, but you can reverse that quite easily.


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[millionsknives]

I think OP needs a knife for both prep and on the line during service? There's no clear answer here unless you have toured the kitchen and know how much space they have. A lot of cooks use 270mm during prep and a short (height wise) 210mm gyuto or even a 210mm suji during service. 270mm knives of course cost more. Having two knives costs even more than that! A 240mm is a good in between size to use for both.

side note... I would use a chinese cleaver for ALL of that. Except for bones, butchery, and fish, where i have specialized knives, I use my chuka for everything. It has the same flat spot length of a 270mm and no tip, doubles as a bench scraper, spatula, and garlic smasher. You need some practice to get up to speed but I would say I'm 50% faster with a cleaver and my cuts are more precise. Hard to find a good stainless one though, all the best are carbon steel

What you need is something not too high maintenance, holds an edge better than your globals, not too thick or thin, not too hard to sharpen. If you are in the EU with your 150 euro budget, these are my picks:

http://www.korin-france.fr/nos-coll...-gyutou/suisin-inox-western-style-gyutou.html

http://www.korin-france.fr/nos-coll...fe-gyutou/togiharu-g-1-molybdenum-gyutou.html

http://www.japanesechefsknife.com/440Series.html

 

[jvous]

Thanks for all the posts!!

I will be working in Edinburgh in a good restaurant. The knife will be needed for both prep and service. Mostly it will be used for precise cuts for vegetable, however it might also be used in very delicate jobs, like the tuna tartare, slicing scallops etc.

I am right handed. As far as handles go, right now I own the global which I guess has a western handle? However, I am open to trying a japanese style aswell. We don't have a lot of time to keep our knives spotless all the time, so stainless would be ideal. In the kitchen many times there simply isn't a water tap right next to you and you don't have the time to wash it every 15 minutes.

I will be cutting on the basic colour boards, rubber/plastic? I don't have the fear that it will get stolen and if it is then I'm sure the guy needed it more than I did. I have very limited sharpening experience but know the basics. The knife costing around 150€, I want to make sure I have the right equipment to sharpen it with.

 

[rick alan]

Typically those who use carbon blades in a pro kitchen will have a wet and a dry towel at their station for cleanup.

 

[foody518]

Huge congratulations on your new position!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Japanese-Da...wood-handle-/252187734703?hash=item3ab78f72af Good value stainless knife, should be thinly ground behind the edge. The factory edge is weak and the knife benefits highly from a quick sharpening on the stones to hold up better. If you will be cutting on plastic/poly boards, keep the edge angle a bit more on the conservative side, closer to 30 degrees total. Handle is raw wood and does better with some oiling and light sanding IMO, and you can ease the corners of the spine a bit with sandpaper or a file while you're at it.

And also http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sakai-Takay...hash=item2a695f10d4:m:m0AkYl5ll67A7KoEdhlp0vw

Do you have a sharpening supplies budget?

 

[millionsknives]

My experience with tanaka was I had to do a fair amount of thinning to get it to acceptable.  That was a few hours of time with the blue steel on a coarse stone.  I shudder to think how long it would take to thin VG10.
 

The exception is the R2 steel tanaka which is actually thin behind the edge

 

[rick alan]

Huh, the Tanaka BS got a considerable amount of praise from some on KKF, one big vote for the VG-10, can't say they were the trusted members though.

 

[millionsknives]

Who knows maybe mine was a dud.  It's a question of tolerances.   If you cut a carrot and it cracks and splits, it won't be even.  Rustic home style cooking that I do... I don't mind at all.  In a Michelin starred place that wants perfectly even sized cubes of things in prep, stuff like that matters.

 

[foody518]

It's possible that the Blue Steel lines are more 'workhorse' type of grinds? I think the VG-10/Ginsan Nashiji wide beveled line runs a little thicker as well.

I have a Tanaka VG-10 Damascus nakiri that is pretty thin behind the edge and normal at the spine. Almost on par cutting to a Shibata Kotetsu Bunka, which is a line that runs laser-ish. Have also gifted one of those cheaper 2 rivet handle Tanaka VG-10 Damascus 190mm gyuto to a friend's family, and that ran respectably thin as well. I recognize that this is not close to a full conclusion by small sample size and none of the things I've personally touched being full size gyuto

 

[rick alan]

Absolutely, the OP needs a decently thin edge, and the ones giving positive feedback possibly didn't care.

 

[foody518]

20161019_180925.jpg

• foody518
• Oct 19, 2016

This is what I've got on the nakiri. Wish I had the gyuto to be able to comment more effectively on that